Meet Arminio and Calvinito: they are very, very good friends. Some might even call them best friends. What makes this friendship unique is that all of their other friends hate their friendship. Calvinito’s clan seems to despise all that Arminio and his friends stand for and the same goes for how Arminio’s clan feels about Calvinito and his friends. It puts strain on the relationship of Arminio and Calvinito, to say the least.
Before you can really appreciate this friendship you need to know a little but more about Arminio and Calvinito.
Arminio loves Jesus, a lot. He also has a burning desire to preach the gospel in places that have not heard- which is the very thing that brought him and Calvinito together. Arminio is also a “deep thinker.” He loves to read, study, and discuss the deep truths of the Bible: such as, foreknowledge, sovereignty, grace, salvation, missiology, ecclesiology, and on and on… Arminio and Calvinito have spent many nights worshipping together as they read the Bible and discuss these issues. Every once in awhile(okay, more than they would like you to know), they get into sharp disagreements about what Scripture teaches. Yet, they don’t want this to deter them from their mission to preach the gospel to those who have never heard. They understand what is of first importance.
Arminio is what Calvinito’s friends call an “Arminian.” He believes that people are born sinful, but he also believes Jesus died for everyone, that God’s grace isn’t “irresistible,” that election is based on foreseen faith, and that Christians cannot lose their salvation. While they mock, the friends of Calvinito call Arminio a “semi-pelagian” as he labels himself a “3-point Arminian and 2-point Calvinist.” As the friends of Calvinito mock, Arminio, points out that a majority of the convention they all belong to agree with him as- 3 point Arminians and 2 point Calvinists. Oh yeah, Arminio and Calvinito are Southern Baptists- because they are convictional Baptists and love the missions work that the SBC does.
Arminio is deeply, intellectual. He understands all of the arguments and he bases all of what he believes off of what he believes the Bible teaches. He doesn’t make a theological point without kindly showing chapter and verse. This is another reason Arminio and Calvinito get along so well, they are Bible-saturated. Arminio gets as annoyed with his own “kind” as he does with the friends of Calvinito. He realizes that his “clan” loves things called “straw men arguments” and “ad hominem arguments.” He tells his friends that it makes them look like unintellectual loonies. He often says, “If you want the Calvinists to take you seriously stop having emotional knee-jerk reactions to the Doctrines of Grace and do the hard work of digging into the word!”
His friends then emotionally react by rolling their eyes and brushing him off as they think, “He just says stuff like that because him and that bloody Calvinito are friends!” Arminio also realizes that at times his friends do not carry themselves with a Christ-like attitude and posture when speaking with Calvinists.
Now to tell you a little bit about the other side of this friendship:
Calvinito is what everyone considers to be a people person. When people initially meet him they like him instantly. His favorite nights were when him and Arminio would be in the word together: “discussing” and worshipping. He valued those nights because they brought him closer to the Lord and closer to his good friend. Calvinito is what people consider a “5-point Calvinist.” He loves the doctrines of grace and believes that they are exactly what Scripture teaches. John Piper and Mark Dever are his favorite two preachers and authors. He says that it is the ministry of John Piper that made his heart burn for the nations. He wants to be a part of God’s mission of bringing someone of every tribe, tongue, nation, and language into the Kingdom of God.
While Calvinito is very personable, he is also quite smart. Arminio pokes fun at him for only reading people that he can never talk to, until heaven of course. Calvinito stands up for his puritan obsession saying, “They just always seem to say things better than everyone else!” Arminio usually admits that he also loves and appreciates the Puritans, but makes Calvinito admit at least one Arminian author that he enjoys!
Like Arminio, Calvinito gets pretty annoyed at both sides- Calvinists and Arminians. He hates it when Arminio’s friends tells him he his “hyper.” He’s a very laid back guy and he knows they can’t possibly mean that he is a “hyper calvinist” because of his burning passion to take the gospel where it has not been preached and the evidence of that in his life. He also doesn’t like to be called a “Dortian Calvinist.” Not only does he not know what that means, but when he asks Arminio he realizes that even his Arminian friend doesn’t know what that means.
But also like Arminio, Calvinito spends very little time examining the “other camp” and sticks to trying to work things out in his own camp. Calvinito gets annoyed with his own “kind” for a number of reasons. He quickly points out that he agrees with his camps theology, but then goes onto point out the posture they often pose to Arminians. ”Don’t we believe the Doctrines of GRACE?” For putting so much emphasis on grace he knows his camp is often the last to show grace to those who disagree with them. His Calvinist friends can be very arrogant. They often act is if they are intellectual and Arminians aren’t. Calvinito knows that this is not true because of his close relationship with Arminio. Calvinito often admits that Arminio is not only smarter than he is, but that Arminio also studies Scripture with more passion than he has every seen in anyone else. Calvinito also hates it when his friends resort to bad argumentation rather than sticking with the text: as him and Arminio also are sure to do.
Calvinito loves the respect that Arminio shows him, but also understands that the many of the Calvinists do not deserve to be respected because of the pathetic lack of love they show for those who disagree with them. Calvinito also hates it when his camp resorts to petty name-calling. He often tries to point out what is wrong with his friends’ hearts and actions towards Arminians. They also roll their eyes and brush him off by calling him a “compromiser.” Calvinito’s friends like him, but they sure wish he wasn’t so close to that bloody Arminio!
Arminio and Calvinito are both very proud of their friendship. They have a deep love and respect for one another. They pray for each other daily. Many times they get so excited praying for each others missions efforts they forget to take their own needs before the Lord. Despite all of their friends spewing venom at one another and their own theological differences they both understand what is of first importance.
They lock arms and come together for the gospel. They are gospel-centered believers that strive with all of their might to fulfill the Great Commission. They toil day and night: praying, preaching, teaching, writing, and becoming all things to all men so that they might save some. Their hearts burn as they work to present every person mature in Christ.
They face a lot of push-back. They want to see their convention have a Great Commission Resurgence, but they have a hard time seeing it happen. They know they cannot do it on their own. They need their friends, all of them, to come together just as they (Arminio and Calvinito) have come together. All of their friends, on both sides, use the right rhetoric. Both sides say they want to come together for a Great Commission Resurgence, but Calvinito and Arminio both know that their actions say something different. They are to busy fighting over third tier doctrines to come together for the gospel in order to see a Great Commission Resurgence.
Their hearts break as they research and know of all of the people groups that have never heard the gospel, let alone what the differences are between Calvinists and Arminians. Arminio and Calvinito are serving as missionaries right now, Arminio is serving in Laos. Laos is in Southeast Asia and is in the top 10 when it comes to Christian persecution. Two of the pastors Arminio has been training were killed publicly last week and their churches scattered. Calvinito is in South Korea, but desperately trying to get into North Korea. Right now he is trying to figure out ways to smuggle Bibles into North Korea, he has had no success to this point. He knows of the desperate need that exists in North Korea and he refuses to stop trying.
Both Arminio and Calvinito wish their friends would remember what is of first importance and not just in their minds, but in their hearts as well. If they loved one another as Arminio and Calvinito love one another their conversations would be grace-evident. If they truly had love for another they would come together for a Great Commission Resurgence. Calvinito and Arminio know that a GCR will absolutely not happen if their is not a renewed spirit between the two camps. A spirit that says, “We will come together for the gospel so that we might take the gospel to those who have not heard.” Rhetoric is not enough… It takes a transformation of the heart.
Arminio and Calvinito prove that it is possible… It is possible for calvinists and arminians to come together in grace and love, around the gospel, in order to see a Great Commission Resurgence.
Dave Miller (75)
Debbie Kaufman (63)
Rick Patrick (41)
Chris Roberts (37)
Bob Hadley (33)
Frank (33)
Greg Harvey (31)
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dr. james willingham (30)
cb scott (29)
Good thoughts. I think Jake and Johnny also cooperate better when neither of them is busy playing the “persecuted minority” card. A lot of what I wrote yesterday probably applies to this as well!
While I lean more towards their other friend Amy Raldian, I love seeing some of the better Calvinists and Arminians in our convention working together and loving each other in Christ and taking the Gospel to the nations. One of the great things I love about the BFM is that there is room in the tent for both.
George Whitefield and John Wesley are two archtypical reps. of Calvinito and Arminio. Some how they learned after some grievous trials and errors that they could have the highest regard for each other’s destiny while disagreeing on a number of theological points. Theological differences are difficult to navigate and negotiate. They exist obviously, because God appointed them to exist. Why? As I have mulled over that issue, it becomes painfully evident that the variances exist as challenges by which adherents develop and grow as they come to grips with their differences and how to deal with them. In other words, the Lord decreed these things for the development of Christian character and personality that brings honor to the Lord Jesus Christ as it displays those graces developing in spiritual and mental conflict and turmoil. Many, if not all, of the issues of differences really involve our perspectives and takes on aspects or elements of two-sided and apparently contradictory teachings of biblical revelation. Take, for example, the doctrine of salvation as it involves God’s sovereignty and human responsibility. Man is responsible or accountable, liable and blameable for his sins and for his failures to heed God’s law revealed in both nature and the Bible. God is sovereign, and he can show mercy and grace when and wherever and to whomever He pleases. Both truths are two sides of the coin. Man’s real problem is his preoccupation with the analytical approach. He looks at the bit, the piece. He either sees all as hanging on man’s decision, or, if he has become inclined to see things from the Divine side, he sees everything hinging on God’s exercise of His good pleasure to save whomsoever He pleases. What the latter individual, the calvinito, has a problem with is realizing that God calls on man to do the impossible (arminio has the same problem, but he does not know it due to thinking man can do whtever he chooses). The impossible, however, is the very nature of the invitation; it is what is called in counseling terms, a paradoxical intervention. Dreaming the impossible dream, doing the impossible thing, even merely attempting such a thing, seemingly ludicrous on the face of it, however, has a curiously empowering effect. It provides somehow or other the wherewithal to triumph, and it does so with remarkably speedy effect. Google paradoxical interventions and note what the writers of various articles on the issue from counseling perspectives are saying. Could this be the wave of the future? And what shall we say, if we find, indeed, many, if not all, of the biblical truths to be of such nature. I can say one thing about such two-sided truths, namely, that they set up a tension in the human that enable the individual believer to be balanced, flexible, creative, and magnetic, a rather wholesome representative of the effects of Gospel salvation, the aim of God’ message and grace surely.
Dr. James,
I’m glad calvinito and arminio have gotten to be such good friends. Can I now introduce you to my friend the paragraph break? He makes your blog comments so much easier to read and all with very little effort.
But seriously, I like the point of this post. I feel like I relate to it well as another pastor in this area and I have very different views on the 5 points but have gotten to know and really appreciate each other over the time I’ve been in this area.
Paragraph breaks are the road to compromise!
Now that’s funny.
I am of the belief that things that are different are not the same. By that I mean, if 2 people believes different things, they can’t both be right. It is possible for both to be wrong but it is not possible for both to be right. I do agree with something Dr. James Willingham when he said, “Man’s real problem is his preoccupation with the analytical approach.” The great divide comes when man, in his flesh, tries to understand and interpret the Scriptures. 1 Corinthians 2:14 (KJV) “But the natural man receiveth not the thigs of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because theya re spiritually discerned.” The fact of the matter is, the Bible says what it says and means what it means. It’s not up for debate. We either accept It all or reject it all. The great danger in accepting part and rejected the rest is the formation of cults. In just about every cult, there is some element of truth. There is just enough truth to take the focus and attenion from the deception & lies. Dr. Vance Havner said once that in his house growing up, there was a clock that didn’t work. He said that even that clock was right twice a day. The reason for Calvanism & Arminism is the result of taking part truth and building doctrine on those part truths. To get something or someone to come together that is different is possible. Take oil and water. All you have to do is put them in the same container and shake them up. They’ll come together and you’ll not be able to tell one from the other. The problem is, give them time and they’ll separate. The reason they separate is because they are different in nature & characteristic. Thus getting back to my original statement, things that are different are not the same.
I just want to give a word of clarification to everyone; due to the accusations against me from the Dr. Caner post. People told me that I hate Calvinists and Calvinism. I absolutely do not. It’s absurd to even think this of me, and if you really knew me, you’d know that that was not true.
I can fellowship and worship with five point Calvinists, and I do….all the time. And, I have no problem with five point Calvinists like some of the profs I had, and like some of my preacher friends that are five pointers; when they’re not obsessed with Calvinism. I mean, some of the profs I had in school, you couldnt even tell that they were a five point Calvinist by the way they taught…sitting in their class. They were not obsessed with Calvinism. Or, I know some Pastors that you’d never know that they were five point Calvinists by the way they preach. They just preach the Bible and lift up Jesus. I know several Pastors right now, who are five point Calvinists, and their churches have no idea that they are…and people, who hear them preach in revival meetings and associational meetings, etc, have no idea that they are five pointers. I have no problem whatsoever with these kind of five point Calvinists. None, Nada. I dont agree with them, but the disagreement is over a minor, finer point of theology.
I do have a problem with the aggressive, five point Calvinists, who are obsessed with Calvinism, who’ve gone to seed over Calvinism, who are committed to winning other Christians and Churches and even the SBC to Calvinism. Those are the ones that I have a problem with. BUT, I do not hate these kind, either. I dont appreciate the tangent they’re on. I dont appreciate the mission that it appears they’re on. But, I do not HATE them.
Anyway, I just wanted to clear that up. Thanks for letting me say this.
I love everybody,
David
David,
I believe every word that you wrote.
Here is my encouragement to you(and this is to myself as well):
How about you and I stop spending time pointing out the faults in the “camp” that isn’t ours and focus on how we can reform out own camps. It seems that in circumstances like this the “plank and speck” concept is totally disregarded.
Both of our own camps have planks and my prayer is that people will start dealing with the planks in their own camps and stop pointing out the other camps issues.
Matt,
It’s not about camps and pointing out the planks and specks for me. It’s about encouraging the SBC Churches and Pastors to not go the way of the extreme, aggressive, five point Calvinists. That’s what it’s about for me. I just do not want to see the SBC go that direction. That’s all.
David
David,
How much time have you spent speaking out against the people in Tennessee that sent out the “smoke out the Calvinists” emails?
Arminians are equally aggressive and yet I have never heard you speak out against them. There are extremes on both sides and my point is that you spend all of your time(and many others) condemning the side you don’t agree with while giving your own camp a pass.
Because of those emails that went around in Tennessee good pastors got fired. Why? Not because they preached TULIP every week and were “aggressive calvinists”… Nope, they got fired simply because they were Calvinists.
How about you speak out about the wrong there is in that circumstance for awhile. Angry and aggressive Arminians are just as damaging to the SBC as angry and aggressive Calvinists. You need to look at the whole picture.
Matt,
I’m not an Arminian, nor was I involved in the “smoke out the Calvinists” emails that were sent out.
I dont know of any Baptist Pastors that are Arminian.
I do know some Pastors that are anti-5 point Calvinists. Yes. I do know some of them.
The Pastor friends that I have that are 5 point Calvinists, I’ve never done anything to get them fired, or expose them, or be mean to them, or anything else but love them and fellowship with them.
David
That is a really good point, Matt. I am often harder on the people that I agree with. I see a blogging tendency to blindly support those whom we agree with while just as blindly criticizing our opponents. But each of us needs to hold our own group to high standards of integrity.
In other words, when Calvinist goes too far, it should be other Calvinists who call him to account, by and large. And when the Anti-calvinist camp gets too aggressive (like the “smoke-out-the-Calvies” thing, the anti-Calvinists should be the ones to hold them accountable.
Doesn’t work that way very often. Same thing is true in most of our blogging debates. For instance, in the Caner/White imbroglio, there has been plenty of extreme verbiage on either side. White’s supporters ought to hold one another accountable as should Caner’s.
This almost never happens.
Feel free to delete or edit this comment if you want to avoid opening a certain caner-worms again.
Usually, when some one is strongly anti- to anything, it is due to a bad experience with some representative of the position to which one is anti. While I can and do live with those who are not five pointers, etc., I do not think any one should hide his or her theology. Indeed, if one is going to preach and/or witness, one must utilize what he or she believes. In my case, I think presdestination is an invitation, and so is total depravity, unconditional election, limited atonement, irresistible grace, perseverance/preservation of the saints, and reprobation. Each point is an intensely inviting truth, winsomely attractive, compellingly wonderful, to the soul that has become aware of his/her need.
Mr. Spurgeon was once asked, what he would do, if he could choose. He replied, “I would choose that God would choose for me.” A friend, Dr. Gene Spurgeon (and yup he was said by a family researcher to be related to C.H.), had one of his converts tell him why she responded so readily to his rather simple plan of salvation: “Oh! It was so wonderful, I couldn’t resist it.” It took Bro. Gene about 40 years to realize that that was the biblical truth. Now remember you folks, C.H. Spurgeon was converted under he preaching of a Methodist lay exhorter. Finney was instrumental in the conversion of A.H. Strong who certainly retained unconditional election and irresistible or efficacious grace. I once knew of a long list of such conversions, but time affects a mental computer just like it does the electrical-mechanical ones with degradation of files.
Let the folks have their Whosoever Will confersences. In fact, let the Calvinists hold such. Don’t you folks know effort is more extreme andme vigorous, when preached by a Calvinist in earnest than an Arminian ever could. Don’t believe me? Look at Jonathan Edwards’ on Pressing into The Kingdom of God. Too bad, you fellows never had th oppotunity to hear a supralapsarian hyper-calvinist like Ernest Campbell preach on the subject, “Why Sit Ye Here Till Ye Die?” or “The Great Supper.” I tell you, tough things are growing darker and darker, that it is like the approach of a hard thunderstorm in Arkansas. The crash of the thunder in Arkansas was recorded by Hollywood and used in the first Star Trek Movie. What lies after the storm breaks is new life for the crops, for the cotton, corn, and soybeans, and the gardens. And what lies in the coming of the hurricane of the Third Geat Awakening is the taking, the winning by the free and easiest ways and means of the whole earth to Christ for a thousand and one generations. Remember: The seed of Abraham is supposed to be as numerous as the stars of heaven, the sand by the seashore, and the dust of the earth.
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