For those of you who are not aware Dr. York is a trustee for the IMB, pastor of Buck Run Baptist Church, professor at Southern Seminary, and the former president of the Kentucky Baptist Convention. I have had the privilege of serving directly under him over the last year. One thing I have certainly noticed is his love for the Southern Baptist Convention. I would argue that it is possible that there is not one person that puts more time into the SBC than Dr. York. He pastors a SBC church, teaches at the flagship SBC seminary, is a trustee on the IMB, and he is very active in his association and state convention.
For these reasons I asked Dr. York 5 short and simple questions. We should be wiling to learn from a man who has put so much time, energy, and heart into our convention. I have certainly learned a lot from him and now I am sharing with you all his answers to the five most basic questions about the SBC.
1) What makes you most proud about being in the SBC?
Our commitment to missions and the exclusivity of the gospel of Jesus Christ.
2) What encourages you about the future of the SBC?
The surge in the number of missionary applicants I am seeing at the IMB.
3) What part of serving as a trustee for the IMB have you most enjoyed?
Getting to know our missionaries and other trustees. We are a varied, quirky, committed, lot.
4) What do you think are the most major issues facing the SBC?
Ecclesiology, soteriology, and cultural relevance will be the big issues over the next ten years. I find myself stunned that we are often so divided on basic issues like baptism and what constitutes a church. I wish I could say the debate on Calvinism is raging, but frankly I see no debate. I see two sides equally convinced they are defending the truth, attacking and mistrusting the other. What is lacking is a civil tone and a personal trust in one another. Cultural relevance will always be an issue for a denomination that sees itself with a global mission yet continues to identify itself with a provincial and regional name.
5) In what ways would you encourage young SBC leaders to be involved with the convention as a whole?
Earn the right to be heard and to have influence by getting involved and serving on every level: association, state, and national convention. There is no shortcut to influence. That takes time and no small amount of serving on committees.
{ 24 comments… read them below or add one }
Dr. York said:
“Earn the right to be heard and to have influence by getting involved and serving on every level: association, state, and national convention. There is no shortcut to influence. That takes time and no small amount of serving on committees.”
Spoken like a professional minister. Many SBC pastors have this mentality that the ministry is a profession like medicine, law, or accounting complete with a secret handshake. Perhaps if these M-div lottery winners who ernestly believe that the church OWES them a comforable living spent less time acting like they are better than the congregations they serve and spent more time wrapping a towel around their waist and washing feet the church might experience a true revival.
Joe Blackmons last blog post..Elf Yourself for Christmas
@Joe Blackmon: I’ve hear the advice about “earning the right to be heard” and I always wonder what they are warning against. The only people who are being hear without paying their dues are bloggers (like me).
“Perhaps if these M-div lottery winners who ernestly believe that the church OWES them a comforable living spent less time acting like they are better than the congregations they serve and spent more time wrapping a towel around their waist and washing feet the church might experience a true revival.”
It would be wise of you to hold your tongue when speaking of men you don’t know. Dr. York has never acted as if the church owes him anything. That is why he pours himself out for the church and his congregation.
Matt Svobodas last blog post..The 10 books that I most benefited from in 2008
Good word Tony.
It is us bloggers who feel we deserve respect and to be heard, when we really haven’t done much of anything!
Matt Svobodas last blog post..The 10 books that I most benefited from in 2008
Matt Svoboda
I will take your advice and give it all the consideration that it deserves. Thank you.
Joe Blackmons last blog post..Elf Yourself for Christmas
Joe Blackmon,
I am not saying your comment is totally wrong. I personally know a few ministers that fit your comment perfectly, Dr. York is just not one of them.
Matt
Matt Svobodas last blog post..The 10 books that I most benefited from in 2008
I agree with Joe’s comment with an amendment (not at Dr. York, but about influence in general). Years and dues do not earn everyone the right to be heard; sometimes older men just don’t know best. They should still be viewed as a “father” (1 Timothy 5.1), but that doesn’t reach to influence, only respect. Similarly, we must be careful not to look down on people because of their youth (1 Timothy 4.12).
Practically, I think this plays out in the fact that younger guys like JD Greear and Matt Chandler seem to be more in touch with what the church needs to grow into this new century than do many of the gray-headed elites of SBC life, and hopefully we will have sense enough to be influenced by them.
Todd Buruss last blog post..The Reason for the Season- Celebrating Jesus’ Birth in Isaiah 53.1
Todd,
I agree with a lot of what you said. Let’s remember though that people like Matt Chandler have done something that have earned them repect and influence. Some young guys are ‘more in touch’ with the church, but most of those huys don’t have a clue how to run a convention!
Matt
Matt Svobodas last blog post..The 10 books that I most benefited from in 2008
Here’s the deal–making a comment that you need to earn the right to be heard by paying your dues in committee service (as an aside, can anyone point to any bible verse equating committee service with spiritual maturity? Yeah, I didn’t think so) is akin to saying that you have to pay your dues to the “good ol’ boys” network. Reminds me of a bunch of band directors sitting around comparing how many of their students made All-State Band but with preachers it’s more along the lines of “We baptized more than you did last year” or “Our Sunday School has increased attendance by 30%. How about yours?”
Finally, I stand by my original comment. His suggestion that you have to earn the right to be heard sounded very arrogant. Perhaps he did not intend it to sound that way.
Joe Blackmons last blog post..Elf Yourself for Christmas
Matt,
Thanks for the questions for Dr. York. I disagree with Joe that earning your place in the convention is arrogant. It isn’t arrogant; it’s practical and realistic.
I would like you to ask Dr. York one more question. I have heard others say that Dr. York is a Landmark Baptist. Is he?
Thanks.
Les
Les Puryears last blog post..Why are 18th and 19th Century Christian Authors So Theologically Richer Than 20th/21st Century Authors?
I mean no disrespect to Dr. York by my comments… however, when he says things like “Earn the right to be heard and to have influence by getting involved and serving on every level: association, state, and national convention.” That is just about as big a gaff as I have ever heard from a denominational leader.
Just how does a bi-vocational small church pastor in a community of 1200 “Earn the right to be heard” in the SBC? In a denomination that identifies successful pastors by the number of nickels one gives to the CP, and the number of noises they count on their ACP it’s simply never going to happen.
Or, how does a Calvinist Pastor who finds himself in a local association and state convention that is openly hostile to Calvinism “Earn the right to be heard” when year after year he is never given a single opportunity to serve on any committee at all?
The sad truth is that according to Dr. York’s definition there are many faithful pastors in the SBC who will never “Earn the right to be heard”.
Grace Always,
Greg Alfords last blog post..johnMark on Christless Christianity
Greg
You said it. I was thinking it.
Joe Blackmons last blog post..Elf Yourself for Christmas
Greg,
I understand what you are saying, but I think you are wrong. There are quite a few of ’small time pastors’ here in Kentucky that have earned there right to be heard by serving humbly in state convention committees, etc. A small church pastor can ‘earn the right to be heard.’ I think it is arrogant for us to approach this like we deserve the right to be heard no matter what. If someone isn’t willing to humbly serve in smaller aspects such as associations, state conventions, committees, etc. then there voice doesn’t deserve to be heard. Why listen to someone about the convention when they are not willing to do the grunt work?
Matt
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Great books I have read in 2008!
Just to clarify- When Dr. York says, ‘earn the right to be heard’ he does not mean by getting a large popular church. He means earn the right to be heard by humbly serving the convention you want to be heard by! Anyone, at least on the state level, that puts in the time, effort, and energy into the SBC earns the right to be heard.
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Great books I have read in 2008!
Matt,
I appreciate the interview and the opportunity to interact on this subject. Let me say again… I mean no disrespect toward Dr. York, and my comments are not amid at him or anyone else. I do however think that one’s personal experience greatly shapes his or her views on denominational participation and service. And clearly our denominational employees have a different experience within the convention than many of us.
I know that you do not mean for it to come across this way, but you make it sound like everyone has an equal opportunity to serve in the SBC and that it is just a matter of raising your hand and getting involved. Brother that simply is not the case for many of us who have faithfully served the local Churches for many years.
Also, Dr. York’s comments as well as yours, communicate (unintentionally I am certain) that service to the local association, state conventions, and denominational entities are of far more importance to having one’s voice heard in the convention than service to the local Church, Mission Station, Soup Kitchen, or Pregnancy Center. I find this attitude most… unfortunate.
Grace Always,
Greg Alfords last blog post..johnMark on Christless Christianity
Greg,
I agree that everyone does not have the same amount of opportunity. Obviously, in a convention this size that is impossible. What I am saying is your opportunity depends on what you put into the convention. Yes, doing local church ministry is equally important, but it is not realistic for every local church pastor to have a voice in the SBC. What is realistic is the people who put the most into the SBC have the biggest voice. The men who serve on the committees for state conventions do serve in local church ministry as well.
It only makes sense that the people who serve in local churhc ministry, associations, committees, and state conventions, etc. have the largest voice in the convention. It is not equal. The people who put the most in get the loudest voice, period. Serving in the state convention is not better than local church ministry… But realize the people with the loudest voices, like Dr. York, serve in not only local church, but EVERYTHING else… That is the time that Dr. York was talking about. You put the time in that it takes to serve as a local churhc pastor, be involved in your local association and state convention, THEN you will be heard. Being only a local church pastor is not enough, I know that sounds bad, but it is realistic. It is not enough because there are a lot of other people doing more. He who does the most has the loudest voice… It only makes this way!
In your church who would you listen to: the faithful deacon who is faithfully involved in all the church does or the guy in the back that shows up on Sundays?
Matt
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Christmas: The Humble Coming of Christ as an Example for Christians to Follow
Matt,
I understand what you are saying is in fact the reality in the SBC… those in important positions in the convention have the most influence; that is the reality of things. I just have a hard time accepting that you believe that those who have been hired as convention employees, no matter how important their role, should have a greater voice than local church pastors?
I do not wish to belabor our disagreement about this so I will bow out now.
Grace Always,
Greg Alfords last blog post..johnMark on Christless Christianity
Greg,
I also do not want to belabor our disagreement. The only thing I want to do is clarify one thing… I am not saying those who have been hired by the convention should have the greater voice… I am saying those who put the most time and effort in the SBC, in more ways than one, should have he greater voice!
Thanks for the conversation!
Matt
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Christmas: The Humble Coming of Christ as an Example for Christians to Follow
Even when you pay your dues, you can still have people trying to get you fired. I had a DOM who did that very thing. Ouch! Gentlemen we deal with sinners, hopefully saved, but still sinners. And, Alas, we are sinners too. Try getting fired and finding no church open for 12 yrs. then find out that every one in every area of thological beliefs gets fired, makes devestating failures, doing stupid and even wicked things. Remember Peter? He cursed and denied his Lord. And why do so many get so hoity-toity on divorce and remarriage? I knew of a woman who had 3 marriages. The local church would not even let her work in the church nursery, although she contributed two babies to it as well as a son who became a minister and a daughter who would be married to a minister. In turn, her grandsons, one by the son and one by the daughter, would become ministers, too. Some folks need to tear out any of the spiritual and devotional materials written by the murderer and adulterer whom we call David. But when they do that they will take out Jesus also. I rather suspect that we all need to cultivate a sense of humility, sweetness, gentleness, forgiveness. After all, we certainly hope the Lord is forgiving toward us, gentle, sweet, and condescending to our lowest levels to pull us out of our stupidities. And He is or we will never make it. Our Saviour is much better, greater, more loving than we even dream. Let us praise Him and go forward.
Les,
Somehow I missed your question. I have spoken with Dr. York about him being labeled a Landmarker. I assure you, he is not. He does not believe in successionism or that there is anything be special about the name Baptist. Interestingly enough, he holds the same views as Broadus and no one EVER called Broadus and Landmarker!
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Needing some Diversity
Matt,
Maybe Dr. York has changed his views, but I’ve heard him…in the distant past…proudly say that he was a Landmarker. Now, maybe he has changed his mind somewhat thru the years, but I heard him say that in a chapel service at seminary. Again, that was some years ago. And, I hope…that if he’s not a Landmarker, that he has held on to sound ecclesiology while letting the more extreme views of landmarkism go from his beliefs.
David
Volfan,
From what he told me, a few days ago, is that he is not a Landmarker in the classical sense. He holds to high ecclesiology in the sense that he IS a restrictionist when it comes to the ordinances, but he does not believe in successionism and some of the more outlandish Landmark beliefs.
I think it would be wrong for anyone, including himself, to label him a landmarker because it would be like a 2 point ‘calvinist’ being labeled a Calvinist! Make sense?
Yes, high ecclesiology, just like Landmarkers, but also like Broadus who was NEVER called a Landmarker. No, he does not believe in the more outlandish things of Landmark theology. Nothing is special about the name ‘Baptist’, he denies successionism, etc…
Matt Svobodas last blog post..Spirit Baptism, Tongues and the End.
Matt,
I cant read your comment for some reason. But, from the front page, it looks like you’re saying that Dr. York told you that he was not a Landmarker now?
I wish I could read you answer, but your comment is the only one not showing up. Your name and pic are showing. The light blue box that would contain the comment is showing. But, your comment is not in it. Would you mind writing it again, becasue I cant read it. Somethings wrong.
David
Matt,
All of a sudden your comment popped up. Crazy.
I’m glad to hear that about Dr. York. It seems that his view on this has changed a little thru the years. That’s good. I would imagine that he and I would be very close in our beliefs about Church.
David