Comments on: Dr. Albert Mohler Lecture On John Calvin http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/ Southern Baptist News & Opinion Wed, 08 Feb 2012 06:29:18 +0000 hourly 1 By: Scott Douglas http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5806 Scott Douglas Fri, 28 Aug 2009 00:16:06 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5806 Ha touché. I think I meant grow numerically and she probably meant conversion growth. My bad on that one! Sorry about that guys Ha touché. I think I meant grow numerically and she probably meant conversion growth. My bad on that one! Sorry about that guys

]]> By: Joe Blackmon http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5805 Joe Blackmon Fri, 28 Aug 2009 00:02:21 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5805 <i>And when did I ever imply that was “growing” the church?</i> Scott, Not that I necessarily disagree with your point, but she may have thought you mean that when you said <i>The best way to <b>grow the church</b> is 9 months at a time</i> .-= Joe Blackmon´s last blog ..<a href="http://heargodspeak.blogspot.com/2009/08/christian-response-to-health-care_27.html" rel="nofollow">A Christian Response to Health Care Reform pt 2</a> =-. And when did I ever imply that was “growing” the church?

Scott,

Not that I necessarily disagree with your point, but she may have thought you mean that when you said

The best way to grow the church is 9 months at a time
.-= Joe Blackmon´s last blog ..A Christian Response to Health Care Reform pt 2 =-.

]]> By: Scott Douglas http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5804 Scott Douglas Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:30:08 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5804 Sallie, am I understanding you right that it's "unfortunate" for Christian parents to use their families as Gospel ministry fields? And when did I ever imply that was "growing" the church? It's a simple fact that Christians tend to self-replicate, it's been a commonality throughout church history That was the whole point of what I said, that those who raise their children to love Christ (even if they have a Duggar-sized family) have the right to do so and praise God for that Sallie, am I understanding you right that it’s “unfortunate” for Christian parents to use their families as Gospel ministry fields? And when did I ever imply that was “growing” the church? It’s a simple fact that Christians tend to self-replicate, it’s been a commonality throughout church history
That was the whole point of what I said, that those who raise their children to love Christ (even if they have a Duggar-sized family) have the right to do so and praise God for that

]]> By: Sallie http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5803 Sallie Thu, 27 Aug 2009 21:20:21 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5803 Scott -- Unfortunately, I believe many folks have that same thought you just stated. The truth is, though, that only Christ can grow the church. We can not "birth" a stronger church. In Christ, Sallie .-= Sallie´s last blog ..<a href="http://www.mikeandsallie.com/sallie/index.blog?entry_id=1378473" rel="nofollow">Home-made Oatmeal Packets</a> =-. Scott — Unfortunately, I believe many folks have that same thought you just stated. The truth is, though, that only Christ can grow the church. We can not “birth” a stronger church.

In Christ,
Sallie
.-= Sallie´s last blog ..Home-made Oatmeal Packets =-.

]]> By: Dr. James Willingham http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5801 Dr. James Willingham Thu, 27 Aug 2009 18:38:00 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5801 A good spirit in disagreements is a matter to be sought and cherished. Oneupsmanship is always an ugly guest in discussing contentious issues. Does anyone really win when they crush their opponent? God has called us to peace,and, above all, Sovereign Grace should make us people of peace. .-= Dr. James Willingham´s last blog ..<a href="http://thirdgreatawakeningcom.blogspot.com/2009/02/climax-of-reformation.html" rel="nofollow">The Climax of the Reformation</a> =-. A good spirit in disagreements is a matter to be sought and cherished. Oneupsmanship is always an ugly guest in discussing contentious issues. Does anyone really win when they crush their opponent? God has called us to peace,and, above all, Sovereign Grace should make us people of peace.
.-= Dr. James Willingham´s last blog ..The Climax of the Reformation =-.

]]> By: Scott Douglas http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5799 Scott Douglas Thu, 27 Aug 2009 16:45:43 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5799 Thank you Mike! Well said! And his position on that is in response to deliberate childlessness in Christian marriages. The best way to grow the church is 9 months at a time, and raise a godly family that develops into a lifetime of faith. Thank you Mike! Well said! And his position on that is in response to deliberate childlessness in Christian marriages. The best way to grow the church is 9 months at a time, and raise a godly family that develops into a lifetime of faith.

]]> By: Scott Douglas http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5798 Scott Douglas Thu, 27 Aug 2009 16:40:08 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5798 I think you have done your homework on the history of as you call him, the Butcher of Geneva. So, if he had such a prominent role in the city, why was he banished from the city? With the issue of Servetus, you call him a physician but his crime was heresy. He denied the Trinity and was wanted by the Inquisition. Being a man of his time, which we cannot fully understand, Calvin compiled the list of offenses but the prosecution was left to another and the punishment for heresy in that time was death. We cannot read our 21st century mores into a time period we cannot fully understand. It was a capital offense in those days to be a heretic, which sounds so foreign to us but we mustn't past judgment on a law we cannot understand. If anything, Calvin's request for beheading was a macabre sense of humanity, similar to our request for lethal injection rather than electrocution for the condemned. Yes for the life of me I cannot understand how Calvin could baptize babies, but I will also not discredit his overall body of work. Also, don't point out character flaws as "by their fruits." Calvin was a man of his time. We have seen other "men of their time" who held views we look down our noses at. The founders of Southern Seminary were Confederate chaplains, we would look at them in some way as being racist. Martin Luther was a drunk and an anti-Semite with a bad temper. Should we dismiss them for holding views that were common to the age they lived in? Also, are you suggesting that the founders of Southern Seminary, sent by the messengers of the SBC are Presbyterian because they held to the Doctrines of Grace? Is not George Whitefield also a Baptist? What about CH Spurgeon? How about Isaac Backus, William Carey, and others? Just because someone has a Reformed leaning and theological lens does not make them non-Baptist. You should know well enough that there have always been Calvinists and non-Calvinists in the SBC. What's more is that Southern is one of six, so it isn't even a majority of young SBC pastors in training who are being "brainwashed" there. I think you have done your homework on the history of as you call him, the Butcher of Geneva. So, if he had such a prominent role in the city, why was he banished from the city? With the issue of Servetus, you call him a physician but his crime was heresy. He denied the Trinity and was wanted by the Inquisition. Being a man of his time, which we cannot fully understand, Calvin compiled the list of offenses but the prosecution was left to another and the punishment for heresy in that time was death. We cannot read our 21st century mores into a time period we cannot fully understand. It was a capital offense in those days to be a heretic, which sounds so foreign to us but we mustn’t past judgment on a law we cannot understand. If anything, Calvin’s request for beheading was a macabre sense of humanity, similar to our request for lethal injection rather than electrocution for the condemned.
Yes for the life of me I cannot understand how Calvin could baptize babies, but I will also not discredit his overall body of work.
Also, don’t point out character flaws as “by their fruits.” Calvin was a man of his time. We have seen other “men of their time” who held views we look down our noses at. The founders of Southern Seminary were Confederate chaplains, we would look at them in some way as being racist. Martin Luther was a drunk and an anti-Semite with a bad temper. Should we dismiss them for holding views that were common to the age they lived in?
Also, are you suggesting that the founders of Southern Seminary, sent by the messengers of the SBC are Presbyterian because they held to the Doctrines of Grace? Is not George Whitefield also a Baptist? What about CH Spurgeon? How about Isaac Backus, William Carey, and others? Just because someone has a Reformed leaning and theological lens does not make them non-Baptist. You should know well enough that there have always been Calvinists and non-Calvinists in the SBC. What’s more is that Southern is one of six, so it isn’t even a majority of young SBC pastors in training who are being “brainwashed” there.

]]> By: Mike http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5797 Mike Thu, 27 Aug 2009 13:07:38 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5797 "Just as the recent champion of pumping membership rolls by marrying young and having lots of kids whether or not you are mature enough and financially stable enough to do a good job did, in point of fact, stop at having just two kids, had them *after* he was out of seminary." You know, it is interesting: if you knew anything about Dr. Mohler, you might have an idea that it's actually a great blessing he has two kids when the doctors first told he and his wife they would have none. You go off on several diatribes and through that make a personal attack on the man for an unrelated issue that you know nothing about. It is shameful and petty; and really makes me not want to take anything else you say seriously. “Just as the recent champion of pumping membership rolls by marrying young and having lots of kids whether or not you are mature enough and financially stable enough to do a good job did, in point of fact, stop at having just two kids, had them *after* he was out of seminary.”

You know, it is interesting: if you knew anything about Dr. Mohler, you might have an idea that it’s actually a great blessing he has two kids when the doctors first told he and his wife they would have none.

You go off on several diatribes and through that make a personal attack on the man for an unrelated issue that you know nothing about.

It is shameful and petty; and really makes me not want to take anything else you say seriously.

]]> By: Dr. James Willingham http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5788 Dr. James Willingham Wed, 26 Aug 2009 18:40:27 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5788 The fact that Dr. Mohler is a member where the pastor is a an outspoken noncalvinist reminds me of Basil Manly, Sr., and his refusal to intrude his views upon others, while at the same time he was fully committed to the Doctrines of Grace. It might surprise many, but true liberalism develops in the tradition of Sovereign Grace. Roger Williams was a committed believer in these teachings, and yet he wrote religious liberty into law. I want people to believe like I do, but I want them to come on their own, being fully persuaded by the facts as from the heart of God Himself. Like my friend, Dr. Gene Spurgeon who won a young lady to Christ over 40 years ago, and when he asked her why she responded so readily, she replied, "O, it was so wonderful that I could not resist it." He thought about it for 40 yrs. and finally came to the conclusion that she was right. That is how I want to win people. I am not like the Evangelist that another friend of mine knew over 50 yrs. ago. The man told a lie to get some people foward, and justified his lie by the fact that they came!!!! Manipulation, lying, etc., really have no place in doing the will of God and in evangelism. Of course, telling the truth will sometimes involve persecution. Only let us not tell it in a way to make it offensive. .-= Dr. James Willingham´s last blog ..<a href="http://thirdgreatawakeningcom.blogspot.com/2009/02/climax-of-reformation.html" rel="nofollow">The Climax of the Reformation</a> =-. The fact that Dr. Mohler is a member where the pastor is a an outspoken noncalvinist reminds me of Basil Manly, Sr., and his refusal to intrude his views upon others, while at the same time he was fully committed to the Doctrines of Grace. It might surprise many, but true liberalism develops in the tradition of Sovereign Grace. Roger Williams was a committed believer in these teachings, and yet he wrote religious liberty into law. I want people to believe like I do, but I want them to come on their own, being fully persuaded by the facts as from the heart of God Himself. Like my friend, Dr. Gene Spurgeon who won a young lady to Christ over 40 years ago, and when he asked her why she responded so readily, she replied, “O, it was so wonderful that I could not resist it.” He thought about it for 40 yrs. and finally came to the conclusion that she was right. That is how I want to win people. I am not like the Evangelist that another friend of mine knew over 50 yrs. ago. The man told a lie to get some people foward, and justified his lie by the fact that they came!!!! Manipulation, lying, etc., really have no place in doing the will of God and in evangelism. Of course, telling the truth will sometimes involve persecution. Only let us not tell it in a way to make it offensive.
.-= Dr. James Willingham´s last blog ..The Climax of the Reformation =-.

]]> By: Matt Svoboda http://sbcvoices.com/mohler-lecture-on-john-calvin/#comment-5783 Matt Svoboda Wed, 26 Aug 2009 15:20:12 +0000 http://sbcvoices.com/?p=1187#comment-5783 Thank you Mark. It is encouraging to see someone using reason and logic. Mohler's pastor is an outspoken non-calvinist. That says enough for me. Thank you Mark. It is encouraging to see someone using reason and logic. Mohler’s pastor is an outspoken non-calvinist. That says enough for me.

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