A couple of days ago Rodney Howard-Browne, a false teacher in Florida, was arrested for holding services against a state mandate. There are quite a few moving parts to this discussion—and as such I’m a bit hesitant to enter in here. So rather than speaking of Howard-Browne or other pastors being arrested, I want to speak of a general principle here.
I do not believe it is religious persecution for law enforcement to enforce a ban which includes holding religious services. Nor do I believe it is bold and God-honoring to hold such services in the face of a government lockdown. Let me explain why.
First, if churches were the only ones targeted then we have a much different discussion. I understand that some are upset because they feel the government is saying that a church meeting together is not an “essential service”. But “essential service” is less about whether or not you are important and more about whether or not your NOT gathering in physical proximity would do more harm than good. You cannot administer CPR online. Oil, electricity, food services, etc. require physical proximity to accomplish the task at hand. But you can reasonably gather and feed your flock online.
Secondly, this is a Romans 13 situation and not an Acts 5:39
situation. In Acts 5:39 the government was attempting to stop the spread of the gospel. In such an instance you must go against the government. But consider a few things about Romans 13:1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. 2 Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. 3 For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, 4 for he is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God’s wrath on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God’s wrath but also for the sake of conscience. 6 For because of this you also pay taxes, for the authorities are ministers of God, attending to this very thing. 7 Pay to all what is owed to them: taxes to whom taxes are owed, revenue to whom revenue is owed, respect to whom respect is owed, honor to whom honor is owed.
Verse 3 is key here. When the government’s actions are for the furtherance of “good conduct” they are rightly “bearing the sword’. They are doing what God has called upon them to do. And so, yes, it is well within the God-given rights of a government to shut down assembly for the good of the people. It is not infringing upon religious liberty to do so.
Notice, though, what Paul is saying here. (And keep in mind the wicked Roman emperors who were in charge at this time). He is saying that to disobey the authorities that God has placed over you is to disobey God Himself. So it isn’t bold. It’s God-belittling. It’s not trusting in the sovereign care of God. It’s a prideful act of rebellion.
Yes, there are times to disobey the government. There are times for revolutions. There might come a time to fight for religious liberties. But this is not one of them. Saying, “I must obey God rather than man” in this situation is self-contradictory. Because God has told you in his Word that when the government is “God’s servant for your good” you obey God by obeying them.
So, in my mind, these orders are not infringing upon our religious freedom. However, Howard-Browne and others, by ignorantly and rebelliously going against the government in such a time as this, are actually putting in place things which could eventually lead to a loss of religious freedoms.
Here is the principle. If the government’s aim is for our good then we rightly trust in God’s sovereignty and obey. To disobey is not a mere difference of opinion it’s actually a matter of obedience. And I don’t think it’s by accident that several of those still having services are health and wealth prosperity-gospel false teachers. It shouldn’t surprise us that those who do not submit to God’s Word theologically would not submit to God’s governance practically.
Now, if the government’s aim is for tyrannically shutting down the gospel (and it’s discriminatory) then we absolutely must trust in God’s sovereignty and disobey. If they tell us we can no longer meet online—then we have a problem. If they allow some “non-essential” things to resume but not the church, then we have a problem. But we aren’t there at this point.
Originally published at Borrowed Light, Mike’s personal blog.
I am no legal scholar, but you stated it well by my understanding. In extreme cases the government can shut EVERYONE down if needed. If they single out churches for special sanction or favor that is a problem.
The best situation is when churches don’t force confrontation where it isn’t needed.
I mentioned on FB the other day that a threat like de Blasio made to permanently close churches could make me consider taking a stand.
There have been too many outbreaks directly caused by churches that refused to comply. Spreading a deadly virus is not loving our neighbors.
Diblasio is not alone – look at what he and several NYcity council members are saying and doing toward Samaritans Purse. “Monitoring them”.
https://www.faithwire.com/2020/04/01/nyc-mayor-sending-staff-to-monitor-samaritans-purse-nyc-tent-hospital-to-
ensure-lgbtq-patients-treated-equally/
I am not a big FG fan (at all really) – for numerous reasons – but Samaritan’s Purse itself has an excellent track record for truly helping in crisis all over the world and in the US – at no govt. cost – then to receive such governmental vitriolic rhetoric and discrimination simply because of holding to the biblically orthodox view of marriage is ridiculous.
Good thoughts, Mike.
A legit global pandemic/medical emergency matters, imo.
I cannot think of another situation when these stay at home laws and guidance would be more appropriate.
Part of my struggle as it relates to real gathering and worship is 1) even with good reason – forbidding actual and real assembly seems in fact to be forbidding the free exercise of religion, and: 2) for how long are we willing to suspend our worship services?
Here is where I am currently, as I think through this – I am sincerely open to discussion and persuasion.
With regard to 1: I view *my* church not having real worship services as voluntary – we did not suspend ONLY because they said so – but because of wisdom, loving our neighbors, and in the spirit of Romans 13 – we agree (and think the govt. is acting in good faith and for our good) that during this short period of time it is Prudent to suspend gathering in hopes of “flattening the curve”. But, and I think this is important that our people and the govt. understand, that The govt. has no authority (even in a legit crisis) to forbid full exercise of religion – which necessarily includes gathering as an assembly.,
With regard to 2:
Yes. Christians have advocated for and participated in quarantines and such over the centuries – BUT Christians have *also* despite great peril, persecution, calamity, danger and even pandemics Assembled together despite all that.
There may come a time when – should these laws continue for a protracted period of time – that we legitimately have to ask ourselves – is it time to no longer willingly acquiesce to the governmental forbidding of real assembly for worship and resume our gatherings?
May we all pray for wisdom to know when and if that time comes and for endurance should it happen.
Did Florida’s Governor just add churches etc. to the essential list now? How do you guys feel about that? I think it’s a mistake and will cause the virus to spread more now than before in states that do this.
Yes, churches are allowed to assemble together under Governor DeSantis’s new order. I disagree with that. I hope and think most churches will view that as just because we can doesn’t mean we should.
Texas did too.
Agreed, but haven’t they just arrested a a pastor down there?
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/florida-pastor-arrested-after-holding-church-services-despite-coronavirus-orders-n1172276
If abortion clinics can remain open with not only the certain death of an infant in utero, but possible contamination of the workers both in the room and the reception area, as well as the patients in the receiving areas, then how can it not be discriminatory to ban the free exercise of religion with zero public debate, involvement of the judiciary apparatus, et cetera?
If we will forfeit our rights over this illness, when and where will we choose prayerful disobedience? How will we know when we are there? Will it be when SBC Voices tells us its ok? When the media sanctions disobedience?
I’m troubled by the whole chain of events and I am not advocating for uncooperative responses at this time. But I’d be interested to know how we will know when it is time? How will we know when we have transitioned to Acts territory rather than Romans territory?
Simple. Is the government aiming to do harm or calling us to do something directly against Scripture?
It seems, Mike – the answer, regarding scriptural teaching, is Yes. They are. They are forbidding us to assemble/gather together how many times in the New Testament are there commands to gather? (Not to me to mention we are told not to forsake assembling.)
How about the great list of “one another” passages? Some of them can be done without assembling- but others require personal interaction.
How about the Lord’s supper it clearly says “gather” multiple times in that passage.
So in those senses – they are forbidding us from exercising our faith as taught in scripture. No?
For the sake of wisdom and care for our neighbor and for a time (at our discretion under the Scripture) we are acquiescing to governmental and medical guidance.
I tell ya what, Tarheel Dave…go assemble…and see what happens. I dare ya! Are you really looking to get the virus and pass it on to others? Is that what God desires of us? In my state, a church choir gathered together…no one considered the DANGER…now, some people from that church choir have died of the virus, and many more have it. Are you really willing to put other people’s lives in danger because you consider this a “forbidding” thing from the bible? Do you really think that God is honored by Christians endangering other people’s lives, Christian or non-Christian? I’m not getting your thinking at all. Where was the church? Skagit County, Washington State. ..https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-03-29/coronavirus-choir-outbreak. People died, and you are arguing forbidding exercising …as taught in scripture? I’d say that regardless of a government order, prudence and common sense has gone out the window, just for suggesting what you are saying. Forgive me for being so blunt, brother!
Ed Chapman
Blunt does not bother me – I have been known to be so a time or two myself.
In case you missed it – we are not assembling for the time being. We are heeding the public safety guidelines, recommendations and laws. I think that is wise, in keeping with the spirit of Romans and 13 and certainly in furtherance of loving our neighbors…..but, for a time.
I admit I am struggling with for how long, though. Please read my other comments on this thread for fuller context of my remarks to which it seems you hastily responded. 🙂
Guess I just want the government to understand that they have no authority over the public exercising of our faith (in neither spiritual or secular/constitutional sense) and even though we are cooperating here – giving an inch you might say- for common sense and for the good of our fellow man – they better not try to take a mile. 😉
Remove the thought of it being a law, or government order. I’m talking common sense stuff. When the rest of America can come out and play, THEN we gather…however long that takes, that’s how long. This really has nothing to do with Romans 13, it’s just plain common sense to stay home when there is a deadly disease outside.
Respectfully,
Ed
Thank you for the input and interaction.
I think though that I am comfortable with what I have said and where my heart is on this issue.
I am open to further dialogue, but I am not sure we disagree as much as you seem to think we do.
I have no idea when and if there may come a time when we, as many in the rest of the world, choose to assemble and be as wise as possible – even in the face of peril. I am saying that time is not right now – but we must not pretend that time will never come.
One of the problems with American Christianity in my view is that we tend to think that we are immune from “dangerous worship”….this *may*, at some point, test that theory more than we ever thought possible. There are Christians worshiping together in meetings all over the world (and historically too) in the face/threat of intense persecution, and yes – disease and illness.
Immune from dangerous worship? I’m sorry, but I don’t see any example in the bible for that. What do I see? I see John 4, that a woman was telling Jesus that her people said that they are supposed to worship God on a mountain, and the Jews are told to worship God in Jerusalem, then Jesus responds that God is to be worshiped in spirit and truth, not location. But that aside, I see Leviticus and Deuteronomy discussing diseases, in that people are quarantined outside the camp, and they were not to go in the camp until they were clean. The reason? Because what they have is contagious, and obviously God didn’t want them to infect others. My conclusion…There is no such thing as dangerous worship. You don’t put other people’s lives in danger. Not yours, not your wife’s, not your children, not other people’s wives, or their children, not their grandparents, etc. I find it extremely strange that anyone would suggest such a thing as “gathering” in the face of disease and illness, and further making this a Romans 13 issue on top of that.
“ There is no such thing as dangerous worship. You don’t put other people’s lives in danger. Not yours, not your wife’s, not your children, not other people’s wives, or their children, not their grandparents, etc.“
The context of my “dangerous worship” comment included – but also extended beyond the current situation.
Historically many, many Christians would disagree with you. None of them reveled it – but they did exactly what you just suggested doesn’t and should *never* happen. (I think you over spoke and over generalized and I’ll give you an opportunity to revise and extend your remarks. 😉 )
I would also suggest that many Christians *today, right now* are risking as well to gather for worship and proclaim Christ in places like China, Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Somalia, Iran, just to name a few off the top of my head – I am quite certain they too are quite familiar with the concept of “dangerous worship gathering” I alluded to above – the real likelihood of death, imprisonment, etc facing them and their families, and congregants. Yet they still do it.
I realize that we are specifically talking A worldwide pandemic – this is why I say, and have said repeatedly, that suspending worship gatherings for a time is a wise decision. But, if local churches are going to continue to exist in the way the bible describes them (gatherings) then our willing suspension simply cannot be permanent. That is what i am saying.
Ed, I went back and read the newspaper article, and I don’t think it was a church choir, rather a community choir that rented rehearsal space from the Church. Not that it couldn’t have happened to a church choir. It’s an interesting article, except they leave you with the impression it was discovered in 1977 that people broadcast saliva droplets while talking or singing. That was discovered in the 19th century by German doctor Carl Flugge, which is why they’re called Flugge droplets.
James Ellis: I am not for the abortion clinics remaining open as I am not for abortion, but it does not have hundreds or a thousand patients at one time. Churches do. Christians should always be the first at anything promoting good and keeping people safe and healthy. Not the last. And to say they are so we should is following not leading. This virus is serious, causing deaths. Forgive what I am about to say, but don’t know how else to say it, pastors and Christians have to be way way out in left field in their thinking to think otherwise. This is not Biblical at all. Not under these circumstances. If we are pro life let’s be pro life, if you say churches being open trumps saving lives, you are not pro life.
You are able to view and have church online, this is not a civil or religious liberty issue, this is doing what we have to in order to keep people safe. This is a PANdemic.
Debbie,
Thanks for the reply. I’m fully aware of what a PANdemic is and how dangerous this particularly virus appears to be as well. After exposure on March 14, I developed three symptoms – the person whose conduct exposed me developed the full blown COVID19 and has recovered. She also has gone on to continue her work as an RN treating COVID19 patients every day.
I don’t think I was defending the gentleman in Florida who chose to defy the local authorities and your wisdom. I was asking how and when we know if it is time to be prayerfully disobedient.
For what it’s worth, it is a heck of an assumption to assert all churches and members can view services on line. Not everyone has the means. Not every church has the means.
You didn’t answer the question, and that’s ok because I’m not certain there is one. Unlike you, I am not certain that forsaking the assembly of ourselves together is the proper or Biblical thing. I know churches and Christians have overwhelmingly cooperated. It seems good for the short term. But it is gutting Christian service at its core, I see that plainly. It is gutting Christian worship at its core, too. How long?
Mike Leak, you did answer but with a question. So, I will parry back to you. How long? How long is too long. You seem to think as long as ALL assembly is banned, the government has biblical and moral sanction to do so. So, if the government decides a year ban on all sorts of assembly is necessary, you’re good with that God-given right and biblical practice being banned?
Honestly, I don’t know. But can the church still gather in house churches as we round under severe persecution?
James: There are church services on television, radio, a number of ways and good solid preachers too. Beth Moore is on TBN. 🙂
Just saw this, Debbie. That right there was FUNNY! Thanks for the giggle and I pray all is well.
When the rest of America can come out and play, so can we, that is how long. No one should be disobedient. When the coast is clear for EVERYONE, Christian or non-Christian. Prudence dictates that you don’t put people’s lives in danger, therefore, this has nothing to do with “prayerfully” considering being disobedient. Debbie said it best that I have ever heard…pro life. IF you wish to put people’s lives in danger, you are not pro life. If you can’t worship God in Spirit and in Truth with just you and God alone, with your family…
Ed Chapman
Glad it is that black and white for you, Ed. What’s prudent to you may be imprudent to me.
For instance, sounds like according to you, we should shut down our food bank and any other benevolent ministry and tell people to suck it up because Ed says until the government says we can come out of our hovels again, you’re on your own.
It isn’t working like that here. We’ve got people homeless, hungry, unmedicated, exposed to sudden bursts of cold weather. We have shut ins who have literally no one and it is either we go to them and put the free world in danger or they’re outta luck.
BESIDES that, we have people crying out for Christian community that isn’t found huddled around a TV (if they have one) or cell phone watching our livestreams. And we are cut off from that sense of community no matter how many livestreams, videos, memes, or social media outreaches are done. if assembly to worship as the body of Christ together isn’t essential to you, that’s fine. It is to me and I find waiting for a nebulous government decree of “all clear,” “some clear,” or “this but not that clear” to be troublesome, concerning, and perhaps a quick abandonment of rights that have been preserved by facing maybe a little danger now and again.
But you do you, Ed, and I will prayerfully consider what is right and biblical and do that here.
Really the equivalent opposite to PP would be a Pregnancy Care Center, in my opinion, not a church. No one is forfeiting their 1st amendment rights by using common sense in a pandemic. It seems to me that a valid 1st Amendment concern, though, might be if churches receive government financial relief during these days. That might open Pandora’s box.
Generally agree, and it would be well that the pastors were informed. Health and safety of the citizenry is certainly a legitimate role for government – fire codes, etc. It is no small matter to both churches and government that physical gatherings are made illegal for a time.
One might observe that the state, and I generalize liberally here, always justifies it’s action.
I’m thankful we have an entity (the beleaguered ERLC) that is informed and aggressive about protecting religious liberties. I believe it is still the case that many among us would gleefully deny liberties to religious groups that are are abhorrent to us and which have aberrant teachings.
Good thoughts mike, I agree..
Some people think RHB is just still upset that he wasn’t ask to speak at our pastors conference in Orlando…
I think if you were to fight your way to the Supreme Court over the right to assemble, then you might well win. But IMO it is foolish and arrogant to ignore the warnings not to assemble at this time. These pastors holding “in your face” assemblies are, in my opinion, just grabbing at the spotlight. You may have the right to infect yourself, your family, and your congregation with a potentially deadly disease, but it might be the wise choice to pass on that one.
Yeah, I think they would win in court but cause us to lose far more in the long run
Good thoughts…but always remember, Romans 13 can be used as a coward’s covering, so be careful.
Mike,
The most encouraging thing in this article to me is that an actual false teacher has been called out by name by a writer at SBCvoices!! Other than Paula White I have never seen that before here. Thanks
Several names have been called out on this site, I personally think this is a good starting list…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KJmcEAwazD0
Good stuff. Thanks for your thoughts.
While I am not a pastor, I am a health care professional and am incredulous that people are neglecting professional advice to “quarantine” or something similar. What does your church do for the shut-ins? Or what about your missionaries not in this country? From what I am reading, I do not think either case will send believers to hell. What is the underlying fear that I am reading? Fear, instead, facing God when He asks, “How did you shepherd your flock? Did you save lives or expose people to a preventable death?”
Gerald: Keep in mind even after people started dying in this country, many considered the whole thing to be a hoax, fueled in part by people in the party most of us belong to. The current recommendations are considered by many to be overkill. There are some who still think we should just get out there and take our chances. I don’t think that is going to change.
Bill, I have said this before on another board, but if you were experiencing appendicitis who would you go to? A plumber? Or a physician? I hope that elected officials from your party would not say the plumber.
Gerald: I fear they would say the appendicitis was just a hoax perpetrated by the other side and that neither a physician nor plumber were necessary.
Another question that I asked on another board, “How many Hoaxes can one administration blame?” A sad commentary on the great unwashed of us who swallow these things. Where is the little boy to point out that the emperor is naked?
The little boy has been there all along. But no one listens.
Unfortunately, you are correct.
Thanks Mike for the article. No doubt these are trying times for pastors. Whether you are led to temporarily suspend church services or to continue gathering you’re in my prayers. May God grant each wisdom, strength, and skill in these times.
Although my church has not gathered in three weeks (and it is a wonderful local body), I do not condemn those who continue to gather. Gathering on the Lord’s Day is in our DNA. As far as I know, the NT presupposes everywhere that believers will gather. Although some things can be done online, not all things can and it is not the same (see Adam Blosser’s excellent article from a few days earlier).
And I’m uneasy deferring what is “good” for His church or ‘when it’s time’ to government. IMO, He bought us. We belong to Him. Christ made a distinction between what is Caesar’s and what is God’s (Mt. 22:21) and to gather or not is not Caesar’s call.
Moreover, in America, our foremost government is the COTUS, not an elected official or an appointed judge.
May God guide and guard His precious shepherds, may Jesus heal those affected by this virus, and stay its spread.
So were the Christians who hid Jews during Nazi Germany disobeying God himself by not subjecting themselves to the authorities? If disobeying authorities is disobeying God then the Christians in Nazi Germany should have turning over their Jewish neighbors to the Nazi government because God appointed, by this article’s logic, Adolf Hitler to be the leader of Germany in the 1930s and 40s.
Jonathan, respectfully, I don’t think that follows Mr. Leake’s logic at all. Mr. Leake explicitly stated that there are times when we must disobey the government, but not when the ruling of the government coincides with biblical principle. Nazi Germany sought mass destruction of life. Currently, our government is attempting to accomplish quite the opposite. Furthermore, Mr. Leake argued that this is not persecution because we are not being singled out; everyone is being asked to cease mass gatherings. Stopping the spread of a virus and attempting to extinguish a singular ethnic group is hardly comparable.
Thank you, Dean.
When Christian Pastors decide to go for their Spartacus Moment (what ever that is), they need to be sure they are on solid ground not ill thought out emotional quicksand.
Covid is waaaaay overblown. Mr Prez, please restart this economy now