Report is presented in bulletin.
16% of nominations are ethnic nominees.
Brent Hobbs moves an amendment. Replace Thom Polvogt of First Baptist Church of Katy with Johnson Ellis from Prestonwood church in Dallas.
Speaks highly of Johnson Ellis, who was born on the mission field and has been a part of mission work all his life.
Joshua Crutchfield of Texas speaks on behalf of Thom Polvogt.
The amendment fails by a large margin. I’ve never seen it work to replace a committee nominee. During the time of the CR, there was a policy put in place that you were not allowed to speak against the candidate you wanted to replace, but only for the candidate you wanted to promote. That makes replacing a candidate almost impossible.
Brent tried to mention that Thom’s pastor has been very critical of David Platt and according to policy was cut off.
Here’s the problem:
Nominations are announced in the bulletin on Tuesday morning. There no time to make a public campaign if you feel someone is wrong.
You can’t speak against a nominee, only for the replacement.
The deck is stacked. That’s the way we want it, I guess – thus it has always been.
Was that Brent Hobbs? So, was the fella from Prestonwood a Calvinist, and the man from Katy, TX not a Calvinist? Is that what that was all about, Brent? Were you going after someone like you did with Tim Rogers, last year?
Where is the unity and harmony in that? I mean, it wasn’t just Brent Hobbs…apparently a few others were lining up at the mics, along with Brent. smh
Wow!
David
David – you’re assuming – I’ll let Brent speak for himself – I have no idea why he did it but you’re making since assumptions.
It would’ve been nice to actually hear an explanation during discussion but that wasn’t allowed.
It isn’t paranoia if they really are out to get you. I guess.
Michael,
What’s that supposed to mean?
David
Is it unity and harmony to accuse a brother and condemn his assumed motivation? You asked, let him answer before you unload on supposed reasons; and can we not make every fight about Calvinism?
Michael,
Because, that’s what this really appears to be.
David
When you do that to someone…from the floor of the convention….then, you’re embarrassing and humiliating the man. To move that his name be removed….smh.
David
Appears. If he said differently would you believe him?
That’s the first time I’ve EVER heard anyone call Prestonwood a Calvinist church. From everything I’m aware of, that’s wildly inaccurate.
Tim and Randy are both traditionalists, but they are also know for their online belligerence and divisiveness. That’s why I opposed the nomination today and was ready to before Tim Rogers “withdrew” last year. Nothing to do with their views on salvation or any theological issue. I’d opposed anyone associated with the pulpit and pen crowd just as much.
I know Prestonwood is not a Calvinist Church, or at least, I don’t think it is. But, what about the fellow you were wanting to replace Provgot with? Is that man a Calvinist? Also, there’s nothing wrong with Tim Rogers serving on a Board for one year, I believe it was. Also, you act like Randy White is a radical, wild eyed man, who is not acceptable to serve on SBC committees and boards. He is the Pastor of First Baptist, Katy, TX. I guess all of those people in Katy are just wrong about what kind of man he… Read more »
Don’t care if Randy White is a traditionalist or not. Very bothered by the fact that he teaches Peter’s Pentecost sermon is not applicable to the church…
http://www.randywhiteministries.org/2014/02/13/rethinking-acts-238/
Randy White is a very Old School Dispensationalist. To use the terminology of Blaising and Bock, it appears that White is closer to the “classic dispensationalism” of 100 years ago (Scofield, Chafer) than the “revised dispensationalism” of 50 years ago (Ryrie, Pentecost, Walvoord). It also looks like White makes dispensationalism the focus of his preaching ministry and his church’s identity.
After looking at the article linked to, Randy White may be even more extreme than Classic Dispensationalism. He may be a Mid-Acts Dispensationalist!
Though he doesn’t explicitly say it in that article, his descriptions come very close to a 2 gospel divide. I’ve seen that with low budget tv “bible teacher” Les Feldick who some people in my church like listening to. Feldick explicitly states Paul’s “gospel of grace” is a different gospel than Jesus’, Peter’s, John’s, etc. “gospel of the kingdom”. The former being simply believe, the latter repent, believe, and be baptized. I count Feldick as a false teacher because he clearly violates Paul’s warnings in Galatians 1 about there being a singular gospel and anyone who says otherwise is accursed.… Read more »
I definitely don’t like the idea of a layman from a church that preaches this kind of heresy serving as a trustee on one of our mission boards!
Yikes. Classical Dispensationalism greatly bothers me. Didn’t realize there were many still around. Hope thats not the case. As long as he affirms that OT believers are justified by faith then I’ll probably be good.
While I would disagree with some of Randy’s views, he is still a godly man, who faithfully serves his Church. To call him a heretic is extremely mean and hurtful, and it just shows us a lot of what’s wrong with the SBC, today. C’mon. Heretic? Wouldn’t want him serving on an SBC board due to his Dispensational views? Good grief. I am really surprised that Dave Miller hasn’t come down on yall for hurling such insults, and for stirring up such strife and divisiveness. I will guarantee that all of you disagree about something with everyone on the boards… Read more »
“…just shows us a lot of what’s wrong with the SBC, Today.”
😉
Wouldn’t want him serving on an SBC board due to his Dispensational views? Vol, to me it’s not his dispensational views, it’s how close his views skirt to an extreme form of dispensationalism that is anti-gospel because it claims there’s more than one gospel depending on the dispensation you’re in. In his own article he says in Acts 2 Peter was not sharing the gospel we do today and that repentance is not an imperative today. I’m sorry, you can call it divisive all you want but I have a MAJOR problem with that in light of Acts 26:20, 1… Read more »
Vol,
“While I would disagree with some of Randy’s views, he is still a godly man, who faithfully serves his Church. To call him a heretic is extremely mean and hurtful, and it just shows us a lot of what’s wrong with the SBC, today.”
I do not know Randy and you make a reasonable case for granting the benefit of graciousness and assumption of the best intentions toward a fellow pastor – – lets do the same for Brent. Deal?
Actually, I posted two comments here. Both disappeared. Dispensationalists aren’t heretics though classic views can seem a little weird to you young whippersnappers.
“classic views can seem a little weird to you young whippersnappers.”
Classic dispensationalism would have also seemed weird to Augustine, Martin Luther, John Calvin, Jonathan Edwards, all 16 the century Anabaptists, and all Baptists in the world prior to the mid 19th century. Classic dispensationalism seems weird because it is weird. Historians will remember it as a bizarre aberration that was temporarily popular among American evangelicals in the 20th century.
Jeff is winning the internets so far today!
@ Jeff,
Yea, the fact that Dispensationalism is not even 200 years old bothers me as well. But like I said, as long as they (the Classical type) believe that Jews now are saved by faith in Christ, people in the OT are saved by faith, and are not part of the Free Grace movement, then we won’t have any problems! Those seem to be more characteristic of classical though. I think Dispensationalism has made good progress with Progressive Dispensationalism!
Randy White also teaches that Christians are not under the Sermon on the Mount and do not have to obey its teaching. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AMPtClLXuE “What we’ve got here is that Jesus is speaking to those under a different day. And here in our day we are living under grace…. We need to be careful to rightly divide the word of truth…. We’ll mess up if we make [the Sermon on the Mount] the standard of Christian conduct.” In the Great Commission, Jesus says that we must be “teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you” (Matthew 28:20). Randy White’s… Read more »
Jeff,
While I don’t agree with Randy White, he is still a good man, who loves the Lord. And, why would our disagreement on such a non-essential issue cause you to not want him to serve on a SBC board, or committee? Really, it wasn’t even him, it was someone from his Church????
Jeff, why would YOU make such a big deal out of this?
David
And, why would our disagreement on such a non-essential issue cause you to not want him to serve on a SBC board, or committee? Vol, I can’t answer for Jeff, but I can comment for me, especially since I mentioned his theology first. Calvinism/traditionalist, that’s non-essential; same with pre/post/a-mil, private prayer language, etc. But… Saying Peter was not preaching the gospel as we know it in Acts 2? Saying repentance is not an imperative under the gospel as revealed through Paul? Saying we’re not obligated to obey Jesus’ teachings in the sermon on the mount because it isn’t for the… Read more »
As would I, Brent.
Yeah, I don’t know for certain – but might lay bets -If I were a betting man) that Jack Graham might be a little surprised to hear that his church is a “Calvinist Church”
Tarheel and Brent,
Not Prestonwood….but, is the man that Brent wanted to put on the IMB in place of Provgot? Where does that fella stand? I’d like to know? I believe his name was Ellis….right, Brent?
David, I honestly did not ask him and have no indication whatsoever that he is a Calvinist. With his background I would be surprised if he is a Calvinist. I never thought about it until you asked and don’t care how many points he claims.
no answer?
He answered you, Vol – youe not liking his answer does not mean he did not answer.
No comment from anyone about the lack of unity and harmony that Brent Hobbs was trying to stir up?
I think we best wait for Brent to elaborate – if he desires – before all that, Vol. until then you’re making assumptions.
Brent did speak before he was cut off that Polvgot’s pastor had written that the election of Platt as SBC president was a disaster … then he was cut off. So, my guess is that Brent was opposing a trustee from the church of a pastor who clearly opposed the SBC president in writing in the past. I think that is what he meant by a desire for unity.
lol…smh
Polvgot’s Pastor is Randy White, who is an outspoken Traditionalist, who believes that Calvinists are taking over the SBC.
Tim Rogers is a Traditionalist, who believes the same thing as White, about the SBC. Hobbs was ready to speak against Rogers, last year.
David
I think Alan is right.
Vol, you are not making any sense. There were lots of “Traditionalists” on that list who did not get opposed. Whether or not Brent was right to propose an amendment in this situation, you are clearly incorrect in your accusation against him.
Isnt there a Hankins on a board? (I think it is even SBTS board? Seems like I remember that from last year – not one opposed him – not even Brent.
Brent and others opposition to Tim Rogers had nothing to do with Calvinism and you know that.
Come on, Vol.
Video of the nomination: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvMfBfXgCtE
One correction: The Committee on Nominations report is made available by Baptist Press 6 weeks before convention. Changes could be recommended to committee chair and sub-committee could reevaluate.
Good. Thanks for the correction.
But the deck is still stacked and I don’t like it – it does not allow for as messengers to make informed decisions – I have no idea what was going on and I’m ready 99% of other messages and it’s not fair to us as voters to not allow discussion on an amendment.
* And I’m sure that 99% of other messengers did not either.
My understanding is this was a last minute change/addition and information was not available until very recently (today or possibly yesterday).
The Committee on Nominations stated that 16% of trustee nominations for this year were ethnic minority. That is good. In my figures that I acquired by going through each name one by one (because those figures have never been available before), I got 12.5%. One thing that has happened this year for the first time is that all of this is being reported and encouraged more clearly. That was supposed to happen after 2011, but it did not. Hopefully, with the EC report this year, the message will be sent and acted on. So, from reports, Ronnie Floyd selected 20%… Read more »
Yes, thanks for keeping a light on this aspect, Alan.
Me too, Alan!
We can rejoice together!
Yes! We are approaching the numbers that quotas would require and have surpassed (27% in next year’s committee on nominations) what a quota would require.
This is being done without being forced. HUGE change from just a couple of years ago. Those changes have only really been solidified today. So, this is all very good news. Would love to see more change in entity employment in the future, but that is happening.
As someone who doesn’t spend much time on Twitter, this #the15 stuff confuses me. I thought they were a Calvinist group. But Randy White is one of the “15” and apparently no Calvinist. Are they a big tent movement of folks who speak out against the SBC “establishment” from both sides?
#the15 is based on a comment by Ed Stetzer, something about how the same 15 Calvinists got upset at him all the time. Randy White was disgruntled about some of the same issues regarding SBC leadership and Lifeway and joined the group.