The greatest show on earth

Yep the Super Bowl reduced Cam from Superman to Supersulk. The game was short on role models.

BTW, Max,

I hate to state the obvious, but he did play for Auburn.

That’s one for C.B., none for . . . .

John,

I think he’d be effective in the Oval Office or I’d not be supporting him.

I am sure he would either issue or cancel executive orders with which you (and I for the most part) would agree with. And of course you have a right to your opinions, and I respect those. But unless you believe that a gridlocked congress which does little to nothing is an effective governing technique, I have to ask, can you cite any evidence that Cruz would be able to get significant legislation passed? It seems to me that he has made so many in congress mad–both Republicans and Democrats–that unless he has an extremely conservative super-majority of Tea Party types, it just would not happen. Such a Republican super-majority is iffy at best, and it seems to me, is not worth betting four years of possible failed leadership against. But I am open to be persuaded otherwise, so if you can, please convince me.

John

A congress that is truly gridlocked with a conservative president and “gets nothing done” – might actually be a better thing than you seem to think. If they are gridlocked…they cannot pass tax increases, stupid laws, expand govt., and so on.

Might not be so bad.

The biggest thing Cruz would absolutely do is to sign good laws passed by a Republican Congress and select SC Justices that adhere to rigid construction.

John Farris:

That is an interesting comparison. Had not heard anyone compare Cruz to Carter, but there are similarities.

As much as I have said that all of these candidates are flawed, I will say that all of them have strong points, as well.

Cruz is very smart and gets the issues. No doubt. He will not be coopted.

I could say good things about all of these guys.

Cruz is nothing like Carter. They are worlds apart on issue after issue, intelligence, and governing strategy.

Carter was a rubber-stamp to the liberal democrat house and senate….Cruz is certainly not a rubber stamp to anyone. That is one thing I like about him.

When I compared Cruz with Carter, I was referencing the possibility that he would be as ineffective as Carter was, not that they had similar politics or even that they would be ineffective for the same reason. But I am still concerned that, because of his historically poor relationships with even congressional Republicans (not to mention Democrats), he would be ineffective.

Also, I am not convinced that a gridlocked, do-nothing Congress would be good for the country. After all, they HAVE to pass a budget, and there are things that only a national body can do, i.e., infrastructure, treaties, disaster preparedness and relief, the military, etc. For just a moment, think about things as diverse as coinage and safety. Until the advent of the Federal government, each state coined or printed its own money, many to different standards, and until after the Civil War, states, cities, banks, stores, and even individuals could print their own currency, mostly without the hard cash to back it up. While such things are of great interest to collectors today, they were a nightmare for people trying to make a living back then. Think too about working conditions before there were Federal regulations: you had sweatshops in NYC (and tragedies like the Triangle Shirtwaist Fire) for lack of inspections and regulations–and local ones were ineffective or corrupt or both; you had miners killed constantly in cave-ins because there were no mandatory safety standards or inspections; you had railroad workers crushed to death, or loosing limbs, for the lack of safety standards, and it was cheaper to write one off and hire another than to install knuckle couplers and air brakes; you had workers whose wages were cut while requiring them to work longer hours; and you had boiler explosions killing both workers and passengers aboard ships and trains for lack of standards and inspections on a national level! I had a great aunt who went to work in a cotton mill when she was 12 (in Georgia); she told me that they liked to hire little girls, because their hands were small enough to rack back into the looms to clear obstructions and snags while the looms kept operating–and if they got their hands caught, and lost a finger, a hand, or their life, too bad, there were others they could hire the next day. Why? Because there were no Federal regulations, and state legislatures and local authorities proved ineffective at policing such matters. There was a time when the United States lacked a strong central government, during the “Articles of Confederation” period before the Constitution. It did not work in the 1780s and I am certain it would not work today.

Oh, they have to pass a budget? Who knew?

Continuing resolutions have been it as of late. Lol

Seriously – you do realize my tongue was somewhat implanted I my cheek when I referenced a gridlocked congress being a good thing.

No Tarheel I did not realize you were tongue in cheek re: gridlock being a good thing. I have heard too many people (including some on this board) say it in all sincerity.

The fact that continuing resolutions have been the way budgets were “passed” does not make it good, regardless of which party did it. The last time government shut down due to gridlock, several of our families were adversely affected–and they were just working people, not some GS-15 bringing home big bucks.

And thanks, William.

Reagan took his simple vision to the nation first and then worried about Tip O’Neal. There were compromises but everyone remembered his original points. He made a case to the people….first.

Then the ‘representatives’ had to worry about ‘representing’ those that elected them. It wasn’t perfect but a lot of it worked.

“Many Christian leaders and some pastors are not ashamed either and are being sucked in to his carnival show.”

Indeed. Sad to behold. It’s amazing how many potty-mouths suddenly become Christian when they start stumping and targeting evangelicals … and equally amazing that evangelicals fall for it. Carnival performers would have no stage, if it wasn’t for an audience.

Speaking of carnival shows, Cruz held a campaign rally here in SC at Morningstar Fellowship in Ft. Mill. The pastor is Rick Joyner, a disciple of Kansas City prophet Bob Jones who has claimed to feed multitudes with a casserole he made(shoulda been a Baptist), prophesied the 2011 earthquake in Japan would push the US into Nazism, was a big Blood Mooner, and mentioned last week a prophecy from Jones that if the Panthers won the Super Bowl that would be the sign of a third Great Awakening(darn Broncos!) Cruz spoke along side Mormon self styled prophet Glenn Beck. Joyner is regarded as a dangerous heretic here. Cruz attended a national security forum hosted by the church in January.

I get the concerns about Trump. But for you Cruz supporters, these associations Cruz has with guys like Joyner, Copeland, Bickle, Barton and the likes don’t bother you? Politics sure does make for strange bedfellows for this SBC church member.

No we aren’t voting for pastor in chief, but c’mon. I guess heretics votes count too

Even John McCain whose profession of faith was as weak as Trump’s disavowed John Hagee’s endorsement

Jeff P. , McCain and the establishment Republicans and conservatives lump all born again Christians into a stereotype mindset so they do not really know the “players’. We are all the same with interchangeable thoughts and leaders. Dems use to do it but they do not even pretend to want the “Christian” vote. It is just an insincere political play to get the voter who pays little attention.

Jeff P., I am a Trump supporter on the issues. Trump is not running on a faith based Christian value centered campaign. The President of the United States is voted in by all the people to defend the country from all enemies, foreign and domestic. The President is to govern and insure the country’s economic base is on sound ground and to be fiscally responsible. I want a President to enforce our laws, control the onslaught of illegal aliens and correct the political correct society that is eroding fundamental American cultural traditions. I want a President to ensure we have a strong national defense and military and will protect the USA. I want a President that will support the military for real and stop the social experiments of transgender, women into combat roles and not addressing the negative impacts that social liberal policies are having on military effectiveness. I want a President that either win the wars we get into or not get into the war unless it is our direct national interest. I want a President that will stand up to the free trade, anti American interest special money groups. I want a President to follow the Constitution and work with Congress, no executive actions to override will of people.

The country is sick and needs the best Doctor it can get. If I need a heart transplant I will go to the best Doctor available, I will not ask if he is a born again Christian, what he thought 12 years ago and how many times he has been married. At some point I have to trust the Doctor.

It is not the job of the President or the government to enforce the moral and faith based values of people of faith. That is the job of people of faith and the organized religious organizations of the USA, to proclaim and instill moral values. I am not electing Trump to be my moral leader but I do not think he is any more immoral than the majority of Americans. If Russell Moore wants to be anti Trump for whatever reason fine, but that is not what the SBC was founded for.

I think secular Trump is the only change agent running that will at least attempt to implement change. The others are just more of the same in different packages. Cruz loses me with his support of free trade and fast track authority. If the evangelicals in S.C. are going to be like the Iowa voters and go on faith based issues alone, why in the world did not SBC pastor Huckabee , Santorum or Carson soar to the top. We are electing a President not a religious leader. President Obama has certainly not helped any faith based Christian values to be advanced or advocated . Trump is certainly not anti Christian and is doing what he thinks America needs, to change the direction we have been headed. The establishment Republicans and establishment conservatives have used our moral and faith based beliefs to get into office and do nothing but enrich themselves at the expense of the majority of the American people. I like Cruz and believe he is sincere in his faith but even if he wins all the faith based vote in the primary it will be used againist him in the general. Cruz is appealing to faith based voter more than issued centered voters. I will vote for Cruz if Trump out but Trump stronger choice. If not Trump or Cruz Republican lose anyway.

Steve S

I agree Trump isn’t running as a faith based candidate. He has the endorsement of some questionable religious leaders as well like Paula White. But here’s my point.

I’d say the consensus on this board is that Trump shows very little in the way of an observable faith. I’d agree with that, though we can’t change a heart. If he is unsaved, unregenerate, the. He cannot discern the “things of the Spirit,” as he does not have the Spirit, so these things shouldn’t surprise anyone.

No one however doubt Cruz’ faith. Now, you can’t keep someone from endorsing you, but these sorts of alliances go far beyond a simple endorsement. Cruz does have the Spirit, or so I believe we all think he does, yet is embracing and partnering with false teachers preaching another gospel all centered around a theme to have “the body of Christ rise up and restore our nation.” This includes Beck who basically preaches at the events, as a Mormon, in a Christian church.

I don’t question Cruz’ faith. I sincerely question as to whether selfish ambition has superceded his faith. Unless he’s in agreement which takes us back to the territory of Dominionsim and the NAR.

We rail on Democrats as you noted when they use the church to secure votes, but we’re silent when it comes to stuff like this.

In a radio interview yesterday Cruz’ wife literally said he will show America “the face of God,” this on top of his dad saying God has raised him up to restore the nation.

When do we take a step back and say, hmmmmm? Not happening in SC. Yesterday 400 pastors met with Cruz, many who are friends of mine, their charge is to get people to vote, for Cruz.

It honestly all makes me very uncomfortable. I’ll stick with pointing people to Jesus instead of a man.

Politics!

Judge Trumps heart, not change. Of course we can’t do that either

Tarheel, If you disagree with Trump’s immigration proposals what candidates position do you agree with? That would be a start if you answered that question. All of the candidates including Rubio the Gang of 8 Senator who betrayed his voters in Florida has come closer to Trump’s position to curry political favor.

Trump stated a fact during the debate Americans are not going to let people die in the street so why not really repeal Obamacare and put an effective national health care plan in place. The majority of Americans do not like health care but they want reform and a workable fair solution to you health care system.

If a 45 year old man or woman worked for a company for 20 years, company goes to Mexico, they get laid off. They lose their health insurance. A new job, if they get one will due to illegal immigration and our trade policies have no benefits and lesser pay. What is the “conservative” solution. Trump is not a ideologue follower he is a leader who cares for the American people. Cruz was confronted by a voter whose brother had cancer, got laid off and Cruz was asked what would he replace Obamacare with to assist his brother and other . Cruz evaded the issue by avoiding specifics. A candidate stuck mainly on a conservative rigid platform will lose. American want solutions not rhetoric.

Name one thing the conservative anti abortion establishment Republicans have done to really stop abortion. They recently had a chance to defund the abortion money for planned parenthood, they folded like they always do and Obama has his budget he wanted til he leaves office. Trump as President will be as effective as Bush, Rubio, Cruz and all the rest will be in stopping abortion. If Congress sends President Trump a strong anti abortion bill even limiting abortion he will sign it just like the others. Unfortunately the majority of American want abortion to be legal, we just have to try to limit and pray someday it will be eliminated. This is an issue the press and establishment throw out to Republicans to divide the party and get it back to social issues.

thanks for your input, I agree with Trump on the main issues that are really harming the economic and national security of this nation.

“Name one thing the conservative anti abortion establishment Republicans have done to really stop abortion.”

So your answer is to vote for someone who overtly supports abortion (He was “big time prochoice” the last time he ran for President – now that he is running for GOP he decides to pander – I know you reject that he is a panderer – but that does not change the fact that he is)

I actually agree that the establishment in DC has done little, that is one reason I support Cruz. He has been a stalwart, with votes and action to back it up, on the issues I care about, including abortion, smaller govt., and less spending, and has done so going against the establishment. He has been a leader dealing with defunding the baby killing factory known as planned parenthood – its the cowards in his own party that refuse to stand with him and others and sell them out on that.

I say give him a veto pen and send up a bill funding planned parenthood, or some gang of 8 like amnesty bill and see what happens – although they won’t because the establishment will know they have someone there who will veto it – he has demonstrated a willingness (publicly and on the record) to do things that are unpopular but right.

We have no idea what Trump will do because all we have is talk. Vulgar, racist, sexist, rude and disgusting talk.

I am not sure if you have noticed but Trump is now cozying up to the establishment. Behold, the great anti Establishment candidate is turning out to be a “team player”.

If rhetoric is not what people are after as you say – why would anyone be supporting Trump as that is absolutely all he has to offer.

Economically – he’s a man who owes people billions and has declared bankruptcy to avoid some of his creditors, what 3 times? His comments on support of eminent domain are duplicitous in that everyone understands that roads, hospitals, bridges and even keystone require it – but his support and use of it over they years has been to build limousine lots, casinos and other private business ventures. Eminent domain for public use is one thing – so long as its legit pubic use and landowners are fairly compensated – most support it – but for billionaires to use it for personal gain is not what it is about.

he’s a man who owes people billions and has declared bankruptcy to avoid some of his creditors, what 3 times?

4 times.

Let’s be clear. There is nothing inherently immoral about declaring bankruptcy. Better to try and fail than not to try. But don’t declare bankruptcy 4 times and then look the American people in the eye and say “I don’t do bankruptcy”.

I believe that Trump supporters are weighing being ashamed of Trump’s rhetoric vs. being for a well spoken person who is supporting policies they believe are disastrous. And as a person below stated, what is more shameful – what Trump is doing, or what Rubio did running one way and then immediately crossing the line and doing something else? Or are Trump’s outrageous statements worse than what Cruz did in Iowa?

Frankly, I can’t find a person among the leading candidates who is not seriously flawed.

The question becomes how one balances those flaws vs. policy etc., and where one comes out.

I am not voting for Trump in the primary, but I am not condemning those who are. I think that most of them are making rational choices, though I may disagree.

I also don’t think it is proper to get too deep in the weeds about a person’s status with God. We are not in a position to do that. There are ways to address that without making pronouncements that belong to God alone.

If a person says to me, “I am a Christian and I know God” I would challenge them on their theology and whether it was representative of the Christian faith, and I would point them to scripture, but I would not traffic in the ability to personalize the destiny of an individual. I know there are others on here who feel differently, and that’s o.k. by me, but it is not something I would do.

Louis , reflective post

People flock to Trump because they know (after almost 30 years now) that Republicans campaign one way and then govern like Democrats. Name any other Republican in the race (other than Carson) who you believe will actually do what they say if elected, and not go back to business as usual.

All the other Republicans…
– They continually speak about jobs but allow Businesses to take their plants overseas and then bring back products tariff free, destroying the middle class
– They speak of not growing govt. and then grow it more than even the Democrats (see Bush).
– They claim to care about illegal immigration, but keep on granting amnesty and refuse to stop the illegals.
– For that matter, we are in a recession and they would rather keep allowing mass immigration (legally) rather than help Americans looking for work.
– They allow Foreigners to buy up America.
– And on, and on, and on.

At least Trump seems to hate the govt. as much as normal Americans do and he doesn’t try and sweet-talk us like all the other Republicans. Who believes anything they say?

“Name any other Republican in the race (other than Carson) who you believe will actually do what they say if elected, and not go back to business as usual.”

Cruz. He’s been leading the not business as usual contingent of the Senate for several years.

Plus he’s a conservative – no one knows what the heck Donald Trump is because he changes at a whim for political expediency – although for some strange reason people seem to think he’s the “truth teller” and non-pandering politician – it boggles the mind.

He’s run for president before under a totally different platform – now he’s trying in the new way – and sadly his gamesmanship appears to be working with some.

I like Cruz, but he certainly isn’t squeaky clean now that the Goldman-Sach’s stuff has surfaced. I also like the fact he stood up to McConnell.

Regardless, Cruz is only hot on the illegal immigration issue because of Trump, so like all other politicians, he’ll change his tune at a moment’s notice to get votes.

So the notion of “truth-telling” is also a burden for Cruz. It’s amazing that Trump is the only one held to the so-called standard of “honesty.”

Nate, good analysis of Cruz, who I like as my second choice. Trump and Cruz are the only two who represent any real change, except Sanders who is a Socialist. What is the difference in policy between Rubio, Bush, Christie, Kasich? Not too much just in style and their speaking skills.

Trump has changed the race and the other candidates are following and echoing Trump. I do not get the Goldman Sachs concerns about Cruz as he is not wealthy , fought the establishment to get elected with his own resources and is true to his beliefs. If Trump were not in race I would be for Cruz. I do not like his flat tax plan, I think like you said he is softer on illegal immigration than Trump and he has not really stated what exactly he will replace Obamacare with but he is intelligent, true to core beliefs and has a solid value system. If Trump does become President, which he probably will not, Cruz would be great attorney general and really would be great Supreme Court choice.

The international and national big money multi nationals and the ultra rich special interest open borders, anti nation especially America forces will defeat Trump if it takes Billions, They cannot let him win. So to all the anti Trump people who are worried do not, the big guys will stop Trump. Thanks for the post , Nate

Nate, I guess the voters in N.H. think Trump and Cruz honest enough to beat the others put together. Hoping for a 1 and 2 finish for them. Good showing by both but media will act like Bush victory, he spent 36 million dollars.

Trump dominates in N.H., but most (at least on Voices) will say the people of N.H. are crazy.

What they won’t say is Rubio looked pathetic not even able to beat Bush. Of course this is the same crowd that was so upbeat that Rubio was coming on strong after Iowa.

The point is not to jump to too many conclusions and also to realize Trump is a force the rest of the Republicans will have to deal with. However, it will probably not be clear until after Super Tuesday, if even by then.

Bush spent 36 million in NH. Rubio empty suit, no substance. Trump or Cruz or GOP loses. Trump will be target of all special interest. S.C. big test, They have to stop Trump soon.

Again – what is this “Goldman Sachs” thing? There’s nothing there.

He liquidated some of his assets and borrowed against stocks – he did so under regular terms – and received no special treatment. This is very common and nowhere near illegal or immoral.

He, like many many many other candidates before him apparently failed to dot every I and cross every T on an FEC document – however it is important to note that this only came to light (as a faux scandal) because some media outlet found this reporting on his Senatorial report – and noticed it wasn’t on another document – in other words he was in fact reporting what he had done and was in no way keeping it secret – or else the media outlet who reported this would not have been able to find it on the yearly Senatorial ethics report – which he did every single year he’s been in the senate.

Move along. Nothing to see here.

I do agree with you on this. Cruz with no big money backing put up his own money.. I like him for that. Cruz forb Supreme Court, he would be great.

“If we would vote for these men, we are truly lost in the weeds. Darkness reigns.”

Yep, and it don’t matter if the ball is a golf ball, baseball, football, basketball, or the Goodyear Blimp, the weeds are so tall and we will be so lost no one from either party will be able to find us to get us out in 2020.

It was refreshing tonight to see Rubio take responsibility for his loss. Contrast that with Trump’s spoiled brat behavior after he lost Iowa. It gives some perspective on each man.

Scott ,
Youcan spin it that or spin it this way, Trump got the same % of votes than Cruz, Rubio, Bush combined. Bush spent 36 million dollars to come in 4th. Trump taking on establishment and big money.

Rubio – Running away from yet another strongly articulated position when the heat got under his feet, eh?

Rubio clarifies something new every week, it seems. He’s constantly clarifying his position on immigration because he can’t remember who he said he was for it to versus who he’s claiming he’s against it. Rubio can’t even remember which way he voted (with the Establishment or against them) because he can’t do anything without McConnell’s permission.

Also funny how Trump is the only one who the “vast majority of conservatives didn’t vote for”. Well, 35% of them didn’t vote for Rubio, or Kasich, Bush, Cruz, etc. In Iowa, supposedly the vote showed everybody was running away from Trump, yet he gets double his closest competitor in N.H., over triple of Rubio, who almost 90% of conservatives didn’t vote for.

The takeaway is the nation is sick and tired of conservatives who campaign one way and then govern just like the democrats. And, Trump is attracting Democrats to vote for him, something none of the other Republicans (except perhaps Cruz) will ever be able to do, no matter how much they keep trying to attract democrats by governing just like them.

Nate, very dispassionate and reasoned opinion and overview. I agree with you 100 percent. Trump will get crossover Democrats like he did in N.H.

We have found something on which we agree 120%!

John

I am speaking to Tarheel, BTW.

but he is raw and honest.

Come on Steve. How can you keep saying this? You like his policies; fine. You like his style; fair enough. But I just can’t let it go when anyone calls Trump honest or a truth teller when that statement is demonstrably false. Trump’s falsehoods are well documented. How can you keep saying this?

Bill Mac, when i say Trump is raw and honest I mean in the context of his political issues and his new entry into politics. For example whether you agree with him or not you know what Trumps views on immigration are, you know what he thinks of Obama foreign policy and trade deals the other Republicans support. He does not give the standard political answers like a typical politician for now. I do not know or cannot recall where Trump has been dishonest running his campaign, so perhaps you can tell me. I am sure you have something in mind, I just cannot remember a specific but it would not surprise me, he is learning to be a politician after all. What are his well documented falsehoods?

When I say I like his style I mean as a method to come in, with little money and organization and dominate the primary election. Bush spent over 36 million in N.H. alone. Kasich spent months there and 12 million dollars, Rubio has big money backers. Cruz and Trump both spent very little and did great. The voters like their message.

Trump is a truth teller to me when he talks about the rigged game of Washington politics that both parties play. The lobbyist, the big money donors, the foreign government lobbyist, the multi national companies that are dominating events and the disregard for the well being of the American citizens. He knows the game as he has played it.

I believe Trump is truly running for President for the right reason, he does want to make America great again. I cannot think of why else he would do what he is doing.

Bill Mac, he repeated that from the crowd. Again, he is a showman, he is in the lead, he dominates the news cycles, he is getting the others to follow him. Who quotes Bush, Rubio, Cruz, Kasich. It is not traditional it may be uncivil but it is effective. As I have said before about Trump, a large percent of America heard that and thought it was funny as that is how they really talk to each other. It was a comment from the crowd from a woman. As Trump transcends into being more Presidential he will tone down the in your face attitude. Right now he is battling the press, the establishment Republicans, the establishment big money sponsored conservatives and all he has on his side are the voter who are paying attention. Thanks for the input. Take Care

Mr. Thornton, sorry not thinking to clearly, as my support for Trump shows according to many. I lost my very short chain of thought. thanks for you posts and viewpoints.

William Thornton, u can call me cannot keep a name straight. thanks

Trump is a truth teller to me when he talks about the rigged game of Washington politics that both parties play.

So is he decrying the rigged game of Washington? Is that the truth he is telling? That it is bad? Obviously not, since he is part of it, by his, and your own admission.

I honestly do not think he is running for the right reasons. He’s a showman, as you say. He is running not to make America great but to show America how great he is. In fact, that’s all he’s told us for months now, about how great he is. I think no one is more surprised than he is that he’s leading the pack, and frankly it shows what a dark place America has become.

I don’t know why you think Trump will morph from a childish vindictive buffoon to some kind of statesman if he gets elected. He tells people to go >>>> themselves. He calls his main rival a pu##y. He retweets outrageous things from white supremacists. And this just rolls off people’s backs. It is sad.

Honest question: What could Trump possibly do to cause you to stop supporting him?

Bill Mac, at least I got the right person this time. As u can tell I get confused easily.

What could Trump do to stop me from supporting him? I will list just a few, there are more.

1. Support TPP, Fact Track Authority, China trade deals like all the other Republicans do.

2. Take big money donations from all different sources with one thing in common, they all want something. Bush $120 Million for example.

3. Move closer to the positions of the other candidates like they have all moved closer to his positions.

4. Backtrack on his strong immigration law enforcement stance.

5. Backtrack on his eminent domain stance that would not allow the Keystone pipeline to be built if there was no eminent domain, this is a phony issue by the phony talking head conservatives and National Review. Texas Ranger Stadium used eminent domain, what family was behind that?

6. Repeal Obamacare but know it must be replaced with a workable fair health care system. Republicans have done nothing but talk about it.

7. Make America Great Again, hey I got the hat.

There are more but these are some of the things that would make me not support Trump. However who would I vote for if not Trump, as the others offer no real answers, they just follow Trump. Thanks for the question. I would go with Cruz but Trump will get more Democratic crossover votes.

“Honest question: What could Trump possibly do to cause you to stop supporting him?”

He could get elected and then do exactly the opposite of what he campaigned to do. If he did that, then he would be just like Rubio and the Establishment guys. But seriously, considering I think Immigration is the most pressing issue of this election and the future of America, if I thought Trump was going to back away from that, I wouldn’t even think of voting for him.

It’s a fair question Bill, but it cuts both ways.
– There is no way a 3rd Bush is getting elected, so what would make you support him?
– Rubio can’t remember what he said or voted on last week, so what does he need to do to keep your vote? How trusted is the Establishment?
– Kasich looks, sounds, and governs just like Dole, McCain, and Romney. What does he need to do to get your vote
– Cruz is the most conservative of the “politicians” but he’s got hard edges. Is there anything in him that would make you run from him.
– Or perhaps this. Who is the Establishment money flowing to, and why on earth would you vote for that person? Unless you think the Establishment is concerned about Conservative Americans?

Currently the Establishment money is flowing to Bush and if they can’t get him over the edge it certainly looks like it will flow to Rubio. If that doesn’t concern Conservatives then you will get the same old thing. All talk, same inaction.

Nate, again well said and I am with you. If Trump does not win the big money will control America until the second world status is fully achieved.

Steve: I guess my question was more of a moral nature. Granted, we’re dealing with politicians, hardly paragons of virtue. But in my view Trump is more grossly immoral than all of them, moreso than some of them combined. It appears to me that Trump can literally say anything, no matter how egregious, and he wouldn’t lose your support. Is there some moral line that he could cross that would make you drop him?

Trump boasts that he could shoot someone and wouldn’t lose votes, and we pooh pooh it as a joke, but I don’t think it is a joke. If he happened to shoot an undocumented Mexican, some would make him king by acclamation.

Bill Mac, So you really think that Trump really thinks he could shoot someone and his supporters would back him? That any sane person would even consider any more than criminal charges if any shot an innocent person from anywhere. Is that a serious question or are you just pushing the hot buttons. Again for the third time Trump was maybe using a poor metaphor to show how loyal his supporters are.
Why is Trump any more immoral than Rubio for example? Trump has the same value system that the majority of Americans observe. What has Trump done that is so immoral?
If you do not like Trumps character and moral values than that is your issue and right. If you do not support Trump on the real issues, again what issues do you disagree with and why.
I know a lot on this site think Trump is immoral, a liar, files bankruptcy , talks uncivilly, bashes people and is not a true Christian, I get it. So if that is why you do not like Trump it has nothing to do with the issues. I believe Rubio is a proven liar and not honest but I do not hammer him over it, I disagree with his stand on the issues.

I get it Trump is immoral, a liar, not to be trusted, no moral character, not a true Christian etc. Issues are what most people will vote on.

Nate,

You said Cruz is a conservative with hard “hard edges”.

Think we all can agree that Trump has hard edges – so you’re supporting one hard edge candidate over another with one being identified as conservative and the other certainly not.

That leads me to reasonably conclude that hard edges are appealing to you – and conservatism must not be as important.

I find it interesting that the anti big money candidate Donald Trump – the one who is “self funding” But (of course still) accepting donations – turns around and turns over the money that has been donated to his campaign back into his companies to pay for rental of campaign office space, marketing, jet expenses, etc.

If he’s going to “self fund” let him donate all those services and products without reimbursement.

Instead he’s funneling campaign designations back into his own coffers.

Tarheel, Trump has to use campaign money donated to him for his campaign. It is common for all candidates to fund their campaign and repay themselves when donated money shows up. Trump is not taking big money donations, has had no fund raiser and has no super Pac. The only other candidate without super pac is Sanders. Trump has gotten small donations unsolicited and he does sell made in America campaign items that create a surplus. It is really stretching the point when everyone in the race is backed by hugh outrageous sums of secret donor money. Rubio getting millions. Bush spent 36 million dollars in N.H. alone. The money people are trying to stop Trump.

Trump is just telling the truth about money corrupting the system.

“So you really think that Trump really thinks he could shoot someone and his supporters would back him?”

Steve S.,

No, I don’t think “Trump really thinks he could shoot someone and his supporters would back him.”

However, I know he really did make the statement. Therein, Steve S., is the problem and why he should not be president.

cb scott, Rubio said he would not support amnesty or citizenship for illegal aliens before elected to Senate. Went to Senate sponsored Gang of 8 Bill, which House would not pass. Rubio said parents came from Cuba to escape Castro, parents came in 1956 to work and live. So he lied and that is worse than Trump making a stupid statement ?

Bush authorized Florida pension fund to buy millions of dollars of Enron stock when company was folding for Fl state pension fund. Ken Lay big friend. Bush’s wife tried to smuggle in thousand of dollars of purchases made in France to USA to avoid taxes. Worse than Trump making stupid statement. Ralph Camden was going to send Alice to the Moon, he lied , he could not do it. Will not vote for Ralph Camden.

It is okay, I get it the moral, ethical and faith based bar for Trump very high, that is everyone’s right to vote on what they believe is correct. Obama can do no wrong to many people , Trump can do no right to many people, that is what being a true believer is . Rubio is smart, power of the press.

I’ll say this gain. Trump filing bankruptcy does not bother me at all. What bothers me is Trump filing bankruptcy and saying “I don’t to bankruptcy”. Trump faith or lack thereof does not bother me at all. What bothers me is saying “the bible is my favorite book” and then clearly demonstrating that you don’t know anything about it. If Trump is going to slam Carly Fiorina’s looks, then fair enough. It’s uncouth but if you’re going to do it, do it and stick to it. But when you say “I was talking about her persona”, then you’re just a big fat liar. If you’re going to mock the disabled, then be a man and do it (although no real man would do it). But don’t pretend that wasn’t what you were doing.

People try to paint Trump as a man of conviction, but I don’t see it.

Bill Mac, Trump like a true politician and executive parses his words. Legally speaking he did not claim bankruptcy the companies he had an interest did claimed bankruptcy. I have an LLC, small little company that my rentals are in just to protect my personal assets from legal proceedings. My LLC could go belly up but I could keep my belongings. It may be morally wrong to many, it may be unfair, it may be a lot of things but it is not illegal or uncommon. Private capital is still put at risk and without our legal system our economic system will not work.
Trump is an EEO man on attacking his foes, he bashes Bush, Rubio, Paul, Cruz and even lovable Carson about stabbing his Mom. He treats Carly as a equal and with the same mean comments he does to them all. Carly got the better of the exchange and actually it helped her. I do not like it either and Trump will mellow if for no other reason he is becoming a politician. Trump learned from that and will lay off look attacks if goes versus Hillrary. Romney lost because he was too nice and would not really factually attack Obama. Obama killed him. Trump has already shut down Mr. Bill Clinton over his womanizing when they called Trump sexist.
Trump just told Lester Holt, NBC, this morning there is a time and place for certain things. A campaign rally with your supporters is far different than be the elected President. When he is the nominee and President he will act like it. All the business men who have done business with Trump find him professional. All the world is a stage and we all play different roles at different times in our lives. Trump the president will act differently than Trump the candidate. Oh, I forgot he is a lying, immoral, clown and is only a cardboard cartoon figure who is one dimension. Could never act professional, that is why his clown balloon business did well.
Again I know many think Trump is a liar, a clown, immoral, not a true Christian and uses the Bible as a prop. The faith based great candidate that I wanted to vote for was Huckabee, he lost by a lot. Trump is a secular person running for office who is by all accounts is a Christian, how devout is up to individuals to decide and how much weight to apply to that issue. Trump is doing what he has to, to win like all politicians. Trump’s views on faith and religion are shared by the majority of “I am a good person” Americans. Trump is what Trump is, he is as honest as the others running and due to his high profile even more so.
Trump will never meet the bar set by good, moral people who vote based on the religious and observance of Christian values and beliefs. I judge Trump on his policies , his performance, his attitude and his potential to provide badly needed leadership for America. I trust Trump more than lying Rubio and blue blood Bush.

Tarheel, Yes I like hard edged guys. I like Ted Cruz. I also like Trump. I could and will vote for either.

I disagree with you that I’m not a conservative. I think Bush, Rubio, Kasich, and the rest of the Establishment guys are anything but conservative. Again, since Immigration is my biggest issue and I believe the U.S. should protect its borders from invasion, then Trump (and because of Trump, Cruz) are the only candidates I believe will close our borders and deal with the trade imbalances with our Enemies (or what others call our Trading Partners).

Illegal immigration (and even legal) because of our liberal entitlement society is the most detrimental and destructive issue in America. The so-called conservatives (all but Trump and Cruz) will expand entitlements, expand so-called Free trade and continue to spend, spend, spend.

If you consider that conservatism, fine. I consider it a liberal disease.

Nate, You again hit the big nail on the head. Immigration legal and illegal is the number one issue. Without Trump it would not be an issue and they would pass a reform bill as both parties want the same thing, open borders in reality.
Great post but let me send you the responses you will get, Trump is a liar, Trump is a clown, Trump is immoral, Trump is rude, Trump is not a true Christian, Trump is a cheater, Trump picks on women, Trump does not understand issues, Trump is a racist, Trump is a hater, Trump makes things up that he cannot do, Trump cusses, Trump is for socialized health care and Trump is really a liberal just pretending to be a Republican. Trump is only running for his own ego and not to Make America Great. As one SBC leader people stated people who vote for Trump may have lost their Christian values. Trump is stupid. Trump supporters do not know what the issues are and they are low information. I think I covered most of the responses you would get.

Steve s

It’s going to be a bloodbath here. Cruz is already running to the lowest common denominator with a Super PAC backing him running ads that show Trump saying the Confederate flag should be moved to a museum. Of course Trump said that in response to a direct question asking his opinion, which I agreed with. But exactly what does that now thankfully settled issue have to do with this election? What exactly is that ad looking to play too?

jeff P. S.C politics are the very worst, G. Bush for instance convinced voters that McCain had a black daughter, it was his adopted daughter from Pakistan. The press is a foe of both Cruz and Trump and will be glad to stir the pot. Cruz has to do well in S.C. My theory is like Romney if you cannot beat a terrible Obama you should not be President. It is just to bad Cruz and Trump will hurt each other , which is what the money backers of the establishment candidates want. Bush, Rubio, Kasich, they do not care as long as it is not Trump or Cruz. Americans just have to learn what is going on and what is at stake. The flag issue was always a phony issue , why not blow up Stone Mountain in Ga. take Jackson off the 20, once you start rewriting and erasing real history where does it end? The press loves to ask any question of Republicans that make them fight each other and look bad.

Trump/Cruz will finish 1-2 by a wide margin here. You think the anger against the estblishment is palpable across the nation, it is exponentially higher here. The flag issue has a lot to do with that. If Trump survives the assault he’ll undergo here, there will be nothing left to throw at him. It’s not like he has hidden secrets as he has led the most public of tabloid lives for 30 years. How he handles it will determine the winner in 9 days. In SC we have establishment hacks like Graham who would lose in a landslide in his home state if he were still in it. My gut tells me much of the traditional south has the same mindset as SC. This media hype for a viable establishment lane candidate is going to be crushed both here and in the SEC primaries. Trump and Cruz will emerge as the only viable candidates, and that favors Trump. He will do far better than Cruz once the campaign moves to the larger, less Evangelical states that are winner take all.

Jeff P. good rational observation on the ground level, I agree with you and hope you are correct for sake of country. Trump , Cruz are only change agents on ballot, except for Socialist Sanders.

steve, I know, I know,…its looks silly. But this next month will sort it out. I like Cruz, but I just can’t see how he survives. Trump actually has a better chance than Cruz…., yet when the Republican machine gets going things tend to change. And that machine has just started its engine, …so far, the cars have been idling and in neutral.

This is fun!

Chris , I agree, Cruz is my second choice and a good man in so many areas. You are right , the establishment and secret money people will pull out all the stops the next month to stop Trump, they will spend literally millions maybe billions to protect the money machine that both political parties have created. Trump is the only one they fear and cannot control. Look at the media, they refuse to take Trump seriously but the voters do. Dirty trick in S.C. will be brutal like G. Bush used vs. McCain in 2000. The money cannot let Trump win at any cost even if they go to Democrat. Thanks for the input.

bingo….

Chris, that is my dogs nameo. You are right, can Trump hold up to the wave of mainstream press, special interest and both parties who do not want a free agent to open up the Wizard of Oz curtain to reveal who is really running the country. Last chance for average Americans to have a real choice, there will not be another Trump, he is in unique position.

steve, the only thing though. Trump is populist enough, and has worked inside the establishment for so long that he will use both to his advantage. From a policy standpoint, all these guys are pretty much the same. The establishment folks though, do not like…I mean, they do not like giving away any control! This is their greatest fear with Trump. They will control Jeb, Rubio, and Trump (to a lesser degree), but Cruz is not in their wheelhouse at all. Its the lesser degree of control that the Republican money hates. They can crush Cruz, so he is simply a very smart man that will lose in politics this cycle.

Chris, I agree with you on Cruz, what a great Supreme Court justice he would make or perhaps Attorney General. He is too dogmatic for most people who are not use to following detailed and principled thoughts. Trump is a pragmatic person who does get things done which the purist pretend is bad but it is life and historical facts.

Tarheel, Trump is for universal health care reform, getting rid of Obamacare but replacing it with a workable free market system for all Americans. Opening up interstate barriers to provide national companies to let people move insurance coverage to a new state is just the beginning. On the debate Trump asked a Democratic talking point question, are you will to let people die on the street who cannot afford insurance? Republicans dance around the issue and just say repeal Obamacare. Most working class Americans want solid health care reform and a fair system. A 42 old American works in a plant in USA, job (ford plant) goes to Mexico, 42 year has no health insurance, gets a lower paid job with no or limited benefits , what is the answer? Platitudes, stump speeches and preaching about a work ethic? Trump is right on the issue and that is why the people not George Will , Sour Kraupterhamner and National Review people banish Trump to the conservative outhouse, they are Washington belt elites. Insurance companies love Obamacare and G. Bushes drug welfare plan for drug companies. Average Americans want a fair open health car system for all Americans. Right now all people in the USA are getting at least basic health care free, even if here illegally. Talk about a broken system.
Ask your family and friends over 65 if they want to get rid of Medicare. Trump is not a “true” conservative and neither am I . Trump will do what is best for American people not the elites, rich, companies and talking heads who live in a bubble they want to maintain.

Trump wants to maintain and strength Social Security and Medicare by economic growth and good management. That is what the vast majority of Americans want. Trump is a realist and I think he really wants to do what is best for American people in all areas. Why in the world would he go thought all this to betray the American people if he wins? Let the stupid conservative establishment Republicans keep talking about cutting or limiting or changing Social Security , Medicare and repealing Obamacare with no plan. There will be use to have election. Romney got tagged with the 47 percent line and Obama won. Will quit here but good questions, take care.

Furthermore, many have paid countless thousands of dollars into Social Security and yet the Establishment has stolen every penny, and they give it to illegals and others. So, should people who paid their entire working lives into Social Security not get any return on their investment?

If you argue that Social Security wasn’t an investment, then what was it? Robbery? Cheating the working-class? The Establishment Republicans want to reform it (supposedly), but at what cost (and who pays)? Oh yeah, those who paid in the most.

If you don’t think that is vulgar and offensive, then you might be an Establishment guy…

“Trump is for universal health care reform, getting rid of Obamacare but replacing it with a workable free market system for all Americans.”

Problem is that not what he actually said….

He actually said in the first debate and later in an interview with 60minutes that he favors “healthcare for all, that the government pays for.”

Tarheel, I was referencing last debate however I believe what you post. Whatever the solution is it must be better than Obamacare and Americans from low income to high middle income, all Americans should have access to affordable health care. Trump and Congress can work out the details but the majority of Americans support major health care reform. If vote was taken right now on getting rid of Obamacare or going back to old system , majority would say keep Obamacare and it is a financial mess and does not reform health care. Take care of Americans first. The other Republicans may make this an issue but it will weaken the party. Americans want to be treated fairly .

Nate, I am with you as usual,do not understand the typical Republican position, like Paul Ryan etc. Americans like and want S.S and Medicare, they just want it to be used correctly.

Repealing Obamacare is a pipe dream. It is a disaster, but it is now a well established disaster that, no matter whether we like it or not, has helped some people. There is not enough political will to repeal it. It must be replaced, piece by piece if need be, with something better.

“Repealing Obamacare is a pipe dream. It is a disaster, but it is now a well established disaster that, no matter whether we like it or not, has helped some people. There is not enough political will to repeal it.”

Bill Mac legislation was recently passed in the House and the Senate to repeal Obamacare. The President vetoed it. I’d say that’s a significant amount of political will.

Bill, Republicans knew they cannot override veto, it is a just a show vote on Obamacare . Trump is right on this issue. Obama care is nothing but trying to get to single payer system and it is first step. Better to come up with workable plan to insure everyone with free marketplace idea than pretending that everyone hates it. If the American people truly hated it they would not have re elected Obama. Of course , the stupid establishment and conservative leaders of the party pushed Romney, a man who gave us Romneycare, so how serious was that effort. Trump should stand firm on this issue and explain it better.

Tarheel, Amen to that. Every candidate gets endorsements that they do not seek or not aware of groups core beliefs. SBC President going to speak to a group voluntarily gives them standing.

I asked Rafael Cruz specifically about this Dominionist accusation in November and he denied that he was a Dominionist. He said the rumor was started when he quoted Gen. 1:26.

I doubt Cruz is a strict Dominionist. This view holds Jesus will not return until the church has established His kingdom on earth and some with this view believe violence is even acceptable to establish the kingdom.

Phrases like “I want America to return to her roots as a Christian nation” and “same sex marriage is a threat to our Christian nation” are spoken everyday. Many evangelicals believe in an End Time transfer of wealth.

I suspect every pastor who comments on this site has uttered a phrase that when parsed would put us in the Dominion camp though we all believe it to be an unbiblical teaching.

RNS is not a friend to conservative Christians and I suspect the most conservative candidates will get the most scrutiny from RNS. Cruz’ dominion theology comments are easily dismissed if you support him and are easy to magnify when you support another candidate.

John Adams once said in a letter “Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other”. Would we label him a Dominionist?

http://www.beliefnet.com/resourcelib/docs/115/Message_from_John_Adams_to_the_Officers_of_the_First_Brigade_1.html

“RNS is not a friend to conservative Christians and I suspect the most conservative candidates will get the most scrutiny from RNS.”

Thank you Dean – your astute observation skills is once again on display for the world to see…

Tarheel, when you agree with my observations I receive the accolades. 🙂

When your stump speech to Evangelicals regularly contains language like “it’s time for the body of Christ to rise up and restore this nation,” it’s difficult not to see a Domionist POV in that

William,

So, you’re against the idea of Cruz winning the nomination – or at least he is not your first choice?

SO tell us who your first choice is so we can nit pick his associations and endorsements.

You said you liked Kasich more and more – for some reason the fact that you like arguably the most moderate person left in the race does not surprise me.

RNS is a legitimate news source as long as one understands its left leanings. One day of reading RNS and you will see they have a slant and report from the slant.

My point is dominion theology is an easy claim to make and a label that can be put on most any conservative Christian. Who is calling him a dominionist is relevant. One who supports Rubio or Kasich would be more apt to interpret Cruz’ statements in the most narrow way. Back in the day the liberals in the convention pinned Paige Patterson as a dominionist.

Having said that, I agree with Plodder that Cruz will have to give an answer for the comments made by Rafael and Huch. Our nation has demonstrated that what a person’s associates may say is not an indictment on a candidate, i.e. Jeremiah Wright.

Frankly, I agree. I thought Bush II was a pretty bad president. However slamming GWB and carrying on a bromance with Putin is pretty bad. And Jeb is not to blame for George.

W said tonight that he was proud to be a part of the establishment. Hammer meet death nail for Jeb!’s campaign

Jeff P, pretty bad when G. Bush is more popular than you, John Ellis Bush should be proud, can you guess what the donors who gave him millions must be thinking?

John, good point or you can say the voting public gave Republicans control of the House by a big margin and control of the Senate to show their displeasure of Obama. If the voters know the Supremes hang in the balance they should really come out to vote. Republicans just need to do what is right sometime and shut up about it.

“. . . or you can say the voting public gave Republicans control of the House by a big margin and control of the Senate to show their displeasure of Obama,” in which case you have two competing mandates. This is getting too complicated for my poor little brain, used as it is to nothing more complicated than Bible study and application!

The only part of your comment with which I (mildly) disagree is the last, the assumption that the GOP controlled Senate should “stand firm” against whomever President Obama nominates. I think they should wait and see who he nominates before deciding against the nominee. Not only is that more fair, it also put Republican candidates in a better position in 2016, especially among Independents.

John

Unless he nominates a jurist with a well established originalist philosophy – which we know it ain’t going to happen – they should hold votes and reject the nominee with votes.

Nate, good concise answer, you are right on, the press is churning this up, they know there is no real issue here. It is just politics been played out but it might get more people to get out for the Presidential election. Obama is no respecter of the Constitution for sure.

There’s no real issue here? A conservative justice dies unexpectedly, leaving a vacancy in a nearly evenly divided supreme court, with a liberal president in the White House. That’s not an issue?

Nate: I didn’t say the Senate was obligated to confirm his nominee. But nominating a replacement is his job, and he is fulfilling the will of the people, since he was duly elected as president and as I said, his term is 4 years, not 3. If the Senate doesn’t confirm, then that’s their business. But whining that the president shouldn’t nominate a replacement is misplaced. If there was a republican in the White House you know very well we would be on the other side of this conversation.

Yep, as would the dems…in fact Schumer of NY proposed that no nominee of W be approved for a full 18 months of his final term.

Also, another thing the media and others are not considering is that the SCOTUS can actually, in the case of a tie in the interim, hold over cases until another justice is seated so that a “4-4 affirmation in the absence of a majority” can be avoided. (meaning that the lower court ruliung stands without SCOTUS ruling on the matter)

In fact given Chief Roberts penchant for “settled law” called “stari decisis” (I think that is how you spell it – means “the matter is decided/settled”) I would think that he would prefer that just that happen.

From SCOTUS watch blogs I have seen (I am weird like that) its widely known that Roberts is prickly about the court not leaving confusion after rulings….and 4-4 rulings would do just that and he is likely to do what he can to avoid that. This might include holding cases over for rehearing if a clear majority cannot be reached with 8 justices, or refusing the hear controversial cases until next term after January 2017. I expect a lot of stay orders until the cases can be heard.

Also it is important to note that the vast majority of rulings are not 5-4 — in fact lots of them are clear majorities… so many cases will likely go on as normal.

My point is that if the GOP senators hold firm there will not be, despite the massive corporate hand-wringing, a constitutional crisis because there are only 8 justices on the bench.