As I was driving to the office this morning, I heard a snip-it from Adrian Rogers. He said that God gave the Ten Commandments to families, and he talked about the commandment to fathers to teach it to your children. It really resonated with me, I agree. It seems like we want God to touch our nation. God isn’t going to touch the nation, He is going to touch people, and we have the responsibility from there.
The 10 Commandments don’t belong in the Courthouse, they belong in your house. They don’t belong in the classroom, they belong in the bedroom. The commands of God, his statues and commands need to be at home before they are anywhere else. Once we share with our kids, we instill it in our kids, it won’t matter what is hanging on the walls in the schools, in the courtroom or anywhere else.
We have tried so hard to make this nation “safe for Christians”. It’s not, and it’s not gonna be. We want our stuff hanging in public. It’s time to get over it, we are living in a post-Christian time in a Post-Christian nation. Time to think like Christians, not Americans. Satan is running the show for now (in as far as God allows), he is the Prince of the Power of the Air. It’s fitting, cause if you tune into the airwaves, watch a little tv, listen to some non-Christian radio (and even a little Christian radio) and you see Satan’s fingerprints. He’s at work, and somehow we have been convinced we can thwart his plans if we can just hang up the 10 Commandments in City Hall. Not gonna happen. It’s time to stop trying to keep Christian’s safe and time to make Christians a threat to the work of Satan. Stop hiding, we have spent too much time creating a Christian sub-culture that keeps us out of community. What are we so afraid of, is greater is He who is in me and he who is in the world. Greater is He who is in your family, in your kids, in your spouse (I pray He is in your family).
Just like I heard Adrian Rogers say this morning, we will effect the education system and the political system when we teach and disciple our kids. When we make disciples in the church, when the lost hear the Gospel and are saved. It’s time to act like we want to change the world. We know we win in the end, time to play the game like winners. Put the 10 Commandments in your heart, in your kids hearts, in the hearts of the people in your church. Then it won’t matter what wall the hang on.
As I read scripture, I see three (3) verses that indicate the Law is applied to the believers heart upon their conversion and new birth along with the gift or righteousness. Let me know if I am right about this.
“who show the work of the law written in their hearts,” Romans 2:15a
“clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, [that is], of the heart.” 2 Cor 3:3
“This [is] the covenant that I will make with them after those days, says the LORD: I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds I will write them,” Hebrews 10:16
There was a time I focused on the 10 Commandments. I purchased “The Ten Commandments” by Thomas Watson and “The Shorter Catechism” by Thomas Vincent used in discipleship by the Reformers. Personally, I catch your excitement more than theirs. I agree that we need to raise the standard for the believer, however, our influence on the world doesn’t seem to be very effective because of how far the world has gone down. We are living in the days of Noah. Our best bet is to reinforce God’s Ark, our families and proclaim the gospel. We must have a trowl in one hand and a sword in the other. Like Shadrach, Meshech and Abed-Nego, our persecution will come. If we don’t have their attitude and their heart we could crumble under the influence of the world.
“”If that [is the case], our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and He will deliver [us] from your hand, O king. But if not, let it be known to you, O king, that we do not serve your gods, nor will we worship the gold image which you have set up.” Daniel 3:16, 17
We are in a New Covenant. This is often forgotten. The New Covenant and God’s commandments do not apply to cultures, nations, societies, or politics. They apply to regenerate persons.
Sal – this is your point of view of the “new covenant,” and it is not shared by all.
Were your POV true, then God would not be justified in holding lost people accountable for their actions, IF “God’s commandments… (only) apply to regenerate persons.”
All people are accountable to God and they are judged by His commandments. They are accountable to give Him honor and worship and glory and to submit themselves to His judgment for their sins. This is clear form Romans chapter 1.
Greg, they apply in terms of accountability. What I meant to say is that Christians are the ones who wind up embracing them and living them in the Spirit, not in the old way of the written code. In terms of what C. S. Lewis termed the Tao, they serve as an understanding of life, generally. But to apply it in a precise manner to groups does not make sense. They wouldn’t accept it that way anyhow.
ok…. i was confused and still am a bit…
Do you mean to say:
1) that Christians are the only ones who will actually live them out
2) non-Christians cannot be expected to follow the 10 commandments (as law, God given or US code)
3) all are going to be judged by them
4) we should or should not try to apply them to non-believers as a social standard or locally enforced laws
Any or all? Just trying to understand what you are saying. I dislike being misunderstood and therefore, I don’t want to misunderstand you 🙂
I think “the law” is written on our hearts if we are Chrsitian. The Spirit empowers us to live the Christian life. Jesus called us to a very subversive ethic that probably even transcends the Ten Commandments in a way (in the New Dispensation we create religious art but don’t bow before it and all days are alike a Sabbath unto God). So Jesus improved upon it if I may put it that way. We are obviously all accountable for what God requires and judged by it whether Christian or not. When it comes to civil law, history attests to the existence of a ‘tradition’ or ‘civilization’ over the millennia that has expected right and judged wrong, whether in the Orient or the West or anywhere else. It’s similar the world over, but civil law in Christian society is more ‘biblically accurate’; we took over the Greek sense of natural law and Aquinas worked on it. But in the final analysis Christians are dealing with the following: life in the Spirit. This is on another order from the situation of all people vis a vis human government and the nature of human structures. That’s the best way I can describe it.
No, they are not judged by his commandments Greg. That is a wrong and I think dangerous theology. They are judged by faith in Christ vs. rejecting Christ. Period. Many unbelievers look as if they live the ten commandments, that does not make them Christians nor is it the way to heaven.
This is where I would differ from many Calvinists, although I am a Calvinist. It’s an important point and too many have no idea what Christ did on the cross. It was more than save people from their sins. It is finished means just that. Including the Old Covenant and the Law.
It’s all about Christ and Christ alone. Nothing else. Not even after salvation.
I’m for hanging the 10 Commandments in the home, the church, the schools, and the courthouse.
The 10 Commandments have profoundly affected our nation in all of those areas. I pray they continue to do so.
You reference one of my favorite preachers. Adrian Rogers is one of the best.
David R. Brumbelow
Sal: On this I agree with your comment. I would rather see the name of Jesus Christ spread throughout the land. I believe that is the message, that is the Gospel.
The Ten Commandments are a if you obey these I will do, but we are now under the New Covenant, which Luke 22:20 says that God has given us a New Covenant to save us, an agreement sealed with Christ’s blood.
Posting or memorizing and obeying the Ten Commandments will never save anyone. Proclaiming the name of Christ and his shed blood is what saves and transforms.
And a father is against his son, a daughter against her mother, and a sword runs through us all.
Yes, Debbie, one musn’t level the testaments. The Old Testament promised the Gospel; it wasn’t the Gospel itself. A profound transition occurred in the pivotal figure of Christ, introducing something radically new: people come to God through Christ by faith, and it happens one by one. Not through entire households including infants, not through whole communities, political entities, societies, or nations or civilizations. It happens individually so that each person is incorporated in Christ. Each one is added onto the Church. The Christian faith goes to the center of who we are in relation to our Creator. Herein lies the importance of soul liberty, soul freedom, soul conscience. Neither the family, nor the church, nor the community, nor the society nor any other entity can mediate for us. In fact, one’s enemies may very well be those of their own houselhold. We stand alone before a God who calls out: where are you? To which the only appropriate response is: Here I am, Lord.
Well said Sal.
In America, we tend to think that we’ve reached the pinnacle of social/political development because our founders based their ideas of government on the Scriptures (and Locke, Montesquieu, Rousseau, and Paine). That somehow makes us a Christian Nation and has given rise to such heretical thinking as Anglo-Israelism and other misguided ideas like dispensationalism.
Has God blessed this country? Yes
Why? For what purpose???
This is probably where most American’s have gotten it wrong because of a misapplied pride in ourselves rather than thankfulness to God. I think God has blessed us so we could bless others (great century of missions,etc).
Somewhere along the way, we say on our laurels and haven’t really gotten up. We’ve tried to affect the world and this country through politics (Christian leaning candidates and parties) and through ill-fated and wasted organizing efforts (moral majority, anyone).
What we’ve forgotten to do is change ourselves through daily walking with Christ and encourage our families and fellow Christians to do the same. There is a sense in this country’s culture that somewhere along the path of life, we reach a plateau: president & CEO, retirement age, supervisor, 1st $1million, this goal, that goal, this one more thing/task/accomplishment and we’ll have reached the “American Dream.”
But in the Christian life, there is no retirement age (hear me seniors) there is no plateau, there is only the climb towards Christ-likeness. We need to hold each other accountable and disciple (not just baptize & dump in a Sunday School class) new believers and see their lives changed by the Holy Spirit.
That will change our country and the world, discipleship into taking up one’s cross and following Jesus. It will never happen because there is a stone monument in a courthouse.
Amen brother.
The law is our school master. They show us how much we need a Savior. Thus, the 10 commandments are really good for the preaching of the Gospel. In fact, all the commands of Jesus are good for the preaching of the Gospel. The laws….and how we cannot keep them…show us our sinfulness….and they show us our need for a Savior.
The law is very relevant for us today.
David
That’s where you and I would disagree David. And that type of thinking is what prompts posts like your lovely worded alebeit misguided alcohol post.
31 “Behold, days are coming,” declares Yahweh, “when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, 32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them,” declares Yahweh. 33 “But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days,” declares Yahweh, “I will put my Law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 34 “They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, ‘Know Yahweh,’ for they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest of them,” declares Yahweh, “for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.”.
Sal’s last comment to me says it well.
Jeremiah 50:45 says “In those days and at that time,” declares Yahweh, “the sons of Israel will come, both they and the sons of Judah as well; they will go along weeping as they go, and it will be Yahweh their God they will seek. They will ask for the way to Zion, turning their faces in its direction; they will come that they may join themselves to Yahweh in an everlasting covenant that will not be forgotten.”
The difference between the law and the Old Covenant is inner transformation vs. outer transformation. Outer transformation only serves to make us feel more comfortable in this world. But it’s never lasting. It is also a we do so God will do Covenant which is no longer valid.
“Nevertheless, I will remember my covenant with you in the days of your youth, and I will establish an everlasting covenant with you … Thus I will establish my covenant with you, and you shall know that I am Yahweh, in order that you may remember and be ashamed and never open your mouth anymore because of your humiliation, when I have made atonement for you for all that you have done” (Ezek 16:60, 62-63).
The only thing the law does now is show people their need for a Savior.
All the scriptures including the ten commandments should be interpreted in light of what Christ has fulfilled. All scripture including the ten commandments, points to Christ.
Debbie,
Where are we disagreeing? I agree that salvation is an inward work…in the heart of man. I agree that the law shows us our need for a Savior….it shows us our sinfulness….that’s exactly what I said in my comment.
Scratching head at this moment, wondering what’s going on….am I in the Twilight Zone, or what?
Romans 7:7..”What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, “You shall not covet.”[a] 8 But sin, taking opportunity by the commandment, produced in me all manner of evil desire. For apart from the law sin was dead. 9 I was alive once without the law, but when the commandment came, sin revived and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was to bring life, I found to bring death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it killed me. 12 Therefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy and just and good.”
David
PS. I also see nothing wrong with my alcohol post. I think its very Biblical and true to what the Bible teaches.
Also, Debbie, I give you this verse in Galatians 3….”24 Therefore the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith.”
And, this is exactly what I said in my comment above that you say that you dont agree with…this is straight from the Bible.
David
Even the inflammatory remarks especially concerning women? Again, we disagree.
And your comment on the law is what I disagree with. If you see nothing wrong with your alcohol post,then your comment above means nothing.
Now give me your interpretation of the passages you quoted above.
Debbie,
What inflammatory regarding women? What are you talking about?
David
David: Again, you must give me what you believe those verses are saying, because in proper context, the law in the Old Testament is given as a do this and live, don’t do this and die. In the New Testament, these verse are simply telling us what a Holy God requires that we cannot fulfill. In fact according to scripture even our good deeds are tainted with sin to a Holy God. This is why Christ came to fulfill the law. So we no longer have to.
Debbie,
I preach the Gospel of grace. I preach salvation by grace thru faith. And, the law just shows us the holy standards of God, and it shows us just how short we fall of God’s glory…and how much we need a Savior.
But, you are really sounding a lot like an antinomian view. Are you an antinomian?
Because, Debbie, I teach the Bible….and, as I teach thru NT books, there are many commands that God wants us to live by…not to be saved, but to please God…to show our love for Him. If you dont think that any commands should be taught, then we’d have to throw out half of the NT.
David
David: The commands point to Christ. The whole Bible from Genesis to Revelation points to Christ, not if you do I will do, which is what the ten commandments are.
Your asking if I am antinomian at least tells me that you are listening to me correctly.
As for the last part of your comment concerning what did you do wrong concerning women, I am not going to answer as I think you know, and as you said in your last comment to Jake, you meant every single word of your post.
Debbie,
I’m not doing this with you. You wont say what inflammatory remarks I made against women, because there’s not any.
So, I guess you are an antinomian. That explains a lot.
God bless you, Debbie.
David
David: I am not antinomian, but to many who are not New Covenant Christians believe I am. So be it. It’s not as insulting as you think, it’s wrong, but it’s an almost welcome charge.
If you read Sal’s comments, we are in agreement on this.
The world and the church–these two exist. But the latter is the visible manifestation of God’s kingdom. As we pray, thy kingdom come, so it does: in the hearts and lives of each Christian. The world does not know Him as we do. It does not even know us. We cannot ignore the great gulf between us. The world and the church…the world grows old and dies, but the church lives on.